Ikelite DS-125 for C-8080/pt-023

[djanni]

The brand isn't necessarily important to this question. It's that I really don't understand the differences between these configurations. These just happen to be the configurations as listed on Ikelite's web site. Can you say which would be the better option for the C-8080 & pt-023 and why?

These versions are available:

1. Package w/ Manual Controller

2. Package w/ Slave Sensor

3. Package w/ TTL Sync Cord

I'm far from deciding on a brand I assume the same configurations are available from Sea & Sea and Inon as well.

For example is there something better than the Inon setup below?

 

[bobf]

A manual controller offers the photographer 10 power level choices of strobe output for a DS series Ikelite strobe. It accomplishes the task by controlling how long the flash unit is allowed to remain on. Think of it as a 10 step timer. Set the controller on F (full) and once the signal to fire is received, the manual controller will allow the strobe it is controlling to remain on until all of the energy stored in its capacitor is discharged. Set the controller to -1 (two clicks from full), and half of the stored energy is allowed to be discharged. -1 is also referred to as -1f/stop. -2 setting on the controller is equivalent to one quarter power, -3 on the controller is equivalent to 1/8th power, etc. Half step increments are also available, ten steps in all.

One advantage to the controller is it's positioning in relation to the user. Other strobes offer similar detent settings, but you have to reach out to where ever the strobe head is positioned, possibly at the far end of the strobe arm (20" distance in my case) when shooting wide angle. However, the manual controller is located very close to the housing. The controller can either receive it's commands from an onboard flash (optically) or in some cases, hardwired directly to a bulkhead.

The Ikelite slave sensor is designed to optically monitor and mimic the flash it is aimed at. The "slave" sensor takes any flash of light it detects and sends an electric signal to the strobe it is controlling to fire. Once the "master" flash of light ceases, the "slave" sensor sends a quench command (cease to fire) electronically to the strobe it is advising.

Unfortunately due to design characteristics, the slave sensor does not work as well with many of the newer tiny onboard flashes. These tiny flashes power up and down too quickly for the larger, more powerful external slave strobes to keep up. The result is that the slave sensor tells the external strobe to shut down prematurely, resulting in underexposed images. For this reason, Ikelite recommends the use of the manual controller over the slave sensor in conjunction with DS series substrobes for the c8080. This is especially true since you will be housing your camera in an Olympus housing.

If you were housing your c8080 in an Ikelite case, the TTL Sync cord package would offer you true Olympus TTL when using DS series Substrobes.

I wish I knew as much about the D 2000 system to say which one would be better for you. An authorised reseller of both models may be better informed to help in your decision. I know that both strobes are built by reputable companies with customer support. The DS 125 has more power and offers a clear upgrade path should you decide to go the dSLR route someday. The D 2000 is smaller and uses AA batteries. The DS 125 has a modeling light that doubles as a night dive light. They should both perform well with your c8080.

hth,
b

 

[djanni]

Thank you, I think I understood that. You right, my next step should be to talk to a reseller. Preferably one who sells both rigs. Would you happen to know of one?

Don

A manual controller offers the photographer 10 power level choices of strobe output for a DS series Ikelite strobe. It accomplishes the task by controlling how long the flash unit is allowed to remain on. Think of it as a 10 step timer. Set the controller on F (full) and once the signal to fire is received, the manual controller will allow the strobe it is controlling to remain on until all of the energy stored in its capacitor is discharged. Set the controller to -1 (two clicks from full), and half of the stored energy is allowed to be discharged. -1 is also referred to as -1f/stop. -2 setting on the controller is equivalent to one quarter power, -3 on the controller is equivalent to 1/8th power, etc. Half step increments are also available, ten steps in all.

One advantage to the controller is it's positioning in relation to the user. Other strobes offer similar detent settings, but you have to reach out to where ever the strobe head is positioned, possibly at the far end of the strobe arm (20" distance in my case) when shooting wide angle. However, the manual controller is located very close to the housing. The controller can either receive it's commands from an onboard flash (optically) or in some cases, hardwired directly to a bulkhead.

The Ikelite slave sensor is designed to optically monitor and mimic the flash it is aimed at. The "slave" sensor takes any flash of light it detects and sends an electric signal to the strobe it is controlling to fire. Once the "master" flash of light ceases, the "slave" sensor sends a quench command (cease to fire) electronically to the strobe it is advising.

Unfortunately due to design characteristics, the slave sensor does not work as well with many of the newer tiny onboard flashes. These tiny flashes power up and down too quickly for the larger, more powerful external slave strobes to keep up. The result is that the slave sensor tells the external strobe to shut down prematurely, resulting in underexposed images. For this reason, Ikelite recommends the use of the manual controller over the slave sensor in conjunction with DS series substrobes for the c8080. This is especially true since you will be housing your camera in an Olympus housing.

If you were housing your c8080 in an Ikelite case, the TTL Sync cord package would offer you true Olympus TTL when using DS series Substrobes.

I wish I knew as much about the D 2000 system to say which one would be better for you. An authorised reseller of both models may be better informed to help in your decision. I know that both strobes are built by reputable companies with customer support. The DS 125 has more power and offers a clear upgrade path should you decide to go the dSLR route someday. The D 2000 is smaller and uses AA batteries. The DS 125 has a modeling light that doubles as a night dive light. They should both perform well with your c8080.

hth,
b

 

[slowhands]

The brand isn't necessarily important to this question. It's that I really don't understand the differences between these configurations. These just happen to be the configurations as listed on Ikelite's web site. Can you say which would be the better option for the C-8080 & pt-023 and why?

These versions are available:

1. Package w/ Manual Controller

2. Package w/ Slave Sensor

3. Package w/ TTL Sync Cord

I'm far from deciding on a brand I assume the same configurations are available from Sea & Sea and Inon as well.

For example is there something better than the Inon setup below?

Well, there are many "Packages" to support an external strobe for your camera. Just be sure you need one, because none of the solutions are cheap; be prepared to spend as much on the strobe and controller as you did on the camera, at a minimum.

Looking at the first option, manual control, Ikelite has a nice controller for that, least expensive, and reliable. You have to set flash power and adjust the camera manually for proper exposure, which can be done but requires experience. A lot of people shoot this way with very good results, so it is worth considering.

Second Option, slave control: The Ikelite hard wired slave controller requires a sensor watching the strobe on the camera fire, which sends control signals to the external strobe to copy the pattern of the on camera strobe. The Inon and Sea&Sea fiber optic coupled slave controllers also require the on camera strobe to flash, and send optical signals to the external strobe to follow that pattern. They can all work well, but have limitations too. The on-camera strobe wastes camera battery power, so you have to change batteries more often. I believe you cannot use super macro mode when the onboard strobe is used, so close flash work is not possible. These are in the middle in terms of cost and performance.

The third option, TTL strobe control, is the best and most expensive. Olympus, Ikelite and a German manufacturer can support it (and there are probably a lot of very high end housing makers that do also, but they are in another price league). The Olympus solution uses a special housing and cable for their cheap FL-20 strobe, which is somewhat underpowered for underwater use but does work for close subjects. The Ikelite solution requires you to buy a new housing, tray, arms, port, cord, and their strobe (you can't use your PT-023). This is quite expensive -- but works quite well. The German solution uses your existing Olympus PT-023 housing, but adds some electronics inside your camera housing. You can use many less expensive Sea&Sea strobes with this controller, which saves money. This do-it-yourself solution apparently works well, and has a good following in Europe. I will be trying one of these soon, as it seems the best solution for me (but i can't say from personal knowledge how well it works as yet).

If you want an off the shelf solution and can afford the cost, probably the Ikelite TTL system is the best reasonably priced solution for the average diver.

 

[divinman]

I went with the Ike/TTL option. I should have it all put together and underwater by the end of next week. Diving in the green cold water of SoCal. I am also going to use my DS50 on an ike manual controller for fill flash...once it comes back from repair.

I will post my thoughts and results next week.

Terry

 

[thereefgeek]

The 8080/PT-023 with the Heinrich TTL converter and the Sea&Sea YS-90 Duo TTL strobe is what my wife is using. The German made converter is a bit spendy but once you start shooting with it you'll be glad you spent the money.
http://www.heinrichsweikamp.net/blitz/indexe.htm
The tray and arm are from an old YS-25 Auto that flooded (perfect excuse to get the 90)

The new German bulkhead installed in the PT housing:

The new German hot shoe chip (pic is of a 5050 from his website):

The Sync cord has a Sea&Sea end on the strobe side and a Nikonos end on the replacement bulkhead side. Check it out, you won't be sorry.

 

[thereefgeek]

One more thing about the Oly TTL adaptor is that it allows the use of the external strobe in "Super Macro" mode, normally unavailable with the built-in flash triggering an optical sync cord.