Question How to improve dive skills as a rec diver - alternatives to GUE fundamentals course

[DeepSeaExplorer]

I would not recommend the tech route or any other challenging dive courses. Typically, those paths are for strong divers, rather than those still using rental gear. If you don’t already have good skills, it will be expensive and frustrating.

Take the thousands of dollars you would spend for the two of you to take a week-long class and get your own gear. Then go do some practice dives. You already know what you want to improve, you can do most if not all of that on your own.

It will take some time to get comfortable in the new gear, and you don’t want to be distracted with that while in a class.

 

[rx7diver]

My first question on this forum, and in case this is the wrong area to post, please redirect me.

... So my question is for recommendations for an alternative route to getting those recreational fundamental skills in a non-GUE world.

Welcome, @DirkDM.

I received what I believe was extremely thorough training, initially, to start me off. (My initial training, in 1986, was a fifteen-week, YMCA/NAUI, three credit hour university PE course.) Nevertheless, I learned a tremendous lot simply by diving with experienced, competent divers. Watching them dive, attempting to emulate them, and chatting them up all proved invaluable toward improving my fundamental OW skills.

So, initially, all $$ were spent on gear and relatively inexpensive local diving, rather than on taking formal courses.

rx7diver

 

[Sebs]

Since you're in Europe, I'll go ahead and suggest Dahab in Egypt. There's a ton of dive shops with very good technical instructors but I can recommend scuba seekers (Zaki Was my instructor) I took an intro to tech class there, thinking I would do an/dp straight after but my instructor suggested I go get some more experience in doubles because as is my skills just weren't good enough to proceed.

Dahab has an underwater skills park with hoops and stuff you can swim through to check buoyancy.

 

[spc751]

Excellent question yeah you can get really good additional skills training done under a variety of good instructors and agency products.

Here for example is someone who even went through the trouble of making several series of video playlists about it:

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCca6dklxao4M5IY4g94pUnA/playlists

Note that the GUE cult is highly protective and "secretive" about very similar skills sessions with pretty much the same skills--which they didn't actually invent, imagine that!--and yet they try to keep it all private to protect their "GUE [business] Edge" : ) Gotta protect that inflated mantra of being different ('but better'), and the premium-level cash flow! Be warned, it does operate like a cult, after you shell out the first $2-5k of initiation tithes, you will be encouraged to only dive with GUE divers, only take GUE courses, and only buy their specially endorsed products & equipment (customer retention, lots of religions work this way too)

As someone who went through the "GUE Fundamentals" in a twinset & drysuit with someone who was also just an amazing diver/instructor/human being--as well other courses under different agencies--I'll repeat others who say it's almost all about finding a good instructor who covers the skills adequately, honestly and with ample attention to your development of personal competence & comfort. And I think that should be about you and the diving (e.g. TDI vibe), not so much about how the organization renders all other divers to be untouchable heathens (GUE vibe)

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[DeepSeaExplorer]

I just don’t agree with recommending a GUE class to someone that dives a few times a year and doesn’t own gear. Unless something has changed dramatically with their course work, they will be in over their head and will most certainly fail the class.

By the OP’s own admission, there’s some intermediate training and skill building that needs to happen here first.

 

[justinthedeeps]

I just don’t agree with recommending a GUE class to someone that dives a few times a year and doesn’t own gear. Unless something has changed dramatically with their course work, they will be in over their head and will most certainly fail the class.

By the OP’s own admission, there’s some intermediate training and skill building that needs to happen here first.

In defense of GUE they offer the whole range of less technical levels of training--just like everyone else, who was doing it before they were. Rest assured they want to cover all levels of the diver training market.

But I think it is a flawed premise that only GUE offers challenging courses with high performance standards.

I have been in thoroughly challenging TDI courses where another student does not meet requirements and did not get the cert (yet?)

The main difference with GUE is the isolating effect of its culture, the indoctrination, the exclusivity, the uniformity, the robotic "there's only one way" style of training, and the higher prices driving the higher ['non']-profit margin.

It's understandable that Florida cave diving was getting too chaotic, and these guys wanted to make things super predictable in specific cave systems. That's where it came from. The idea that the whole ocean has to be done in their specific brand of team cave-oriented diving is a bit weird for the broader market.

There are some extremely good instructors out there who can cover all the skills and apply rigorous performance standards. GUE shouldn't be monopolizing them, and I would encourage people to consider getting certs from these same instructors under an agency (TDI, IANTD, even PADI) that doesn't impose so much of its own organizational ego onto people.

 

[GJC]

My first question on this forum, and in case this is the wrong area to post, please redirect me.

My wife and I are in our fifties and have been (travel) diving for a while, but with low frequency (70-90 dives spread over many years, warm water only, AOW/Nitrox certification level). We always used rental gear.
On our first liveaboard trip, with conditions a bit more challenging than we had seen before, we really noticed that our skills are not sufficient for those conditions, and also that mastering equipment takes time if you need to adjust each time to a different rental setup. Conclusion was 2 things : we need to get (re)trained to improve our basic skills, and we probably should invest in our (travel friendly) own gear (eg BP/W and longhose setup). I might post a different question about the gear, but this post is about the skills.

After reading on this forum and the web about DIR and GUE fundamentals, I kind of got hooked on the idea of following a training that would step up our skills, and get us comfortable and more relaxed in the water (buoyancy, trim, propulsion) but also ready to respond to emergencies in most circumstances as a Rec diver (including wreck & drift dives, low visibility, ...). The GUE Fundies (Rec) training could be exactly what we need, and is absolutely an option (although probably split in 1 & 2).

Looking at the curricula of other dive agencies as an alternative however, I really do not know what to pick. A Tec intro course ? But then which one ? Maybe we might go for some Tec training some day, but today, we would like to just become much better Rec divers.

So my question is for recommendations for an alternative route to getting those recreational fundamental skills in a non-GUE world. Which course(s) should we follow? Focus should be on acquiring the skills and practicing them until we really internalised them. If you have a particular instructor recommendation, that also would be very appreciated. We live in Europe, so the Med could be a destination for that.

Thanks for your experience and wisdom.

Sounds like you have big spans of time between vacation dives. If you are not going to change that, your best bet (and most economical) would probably be to consider hiring a divemaster to accompany you when you do dive on vacation.

After acquiring your initial skills and any additional training, they will decay over time if you do not dive often enough. To maintain your skills, you need to dive more often. Taking additional courses will not allow you to have big time gaps between dives and be a much better diver.

If you do plan to start diving more often, consider taking courses for the skills you feel weak in (Peak Performance Buoyancy, Navigation, Limited visibility/Night). After getting to 100 dives, consider Solo Diver (you will be a lot safer even if you plan to never dive solo and always dive with a buddy in the future).

 

[Altamira]

I am not sure why you don't try diving more frequently before taking several additional courses, especially anything approaching tech diving. You did not elaborate as to what you meant by 70-90 dives over many years, but I would think it would be difficult to increase or maintain proficiency just by taking more courses. In my opinion, buying your own gear, and using it frequently is going to go a long way toward getting in the groove. Also, consider joining a local dive club, and see if you can find a knowledgeable mentor.

 

[Darnold9999]

I would have to agree with others. If you are not planning on getting your own gear and diving regularly all the advanced courses are going to do is separate you from some cash. I kind of assumed that your plan was to buy your own gear and do more diving. If you just plan to continue vacation diving advanced courses won't do much long term IMHO.

 

[rongoodman]

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