How soon to take AOW after OW?

[Jim Lapenta]

AOW or "adventure diver" is not required for the SEI DRAM Rescue class. OW plus 10 dives is all that's required. A good rescue class is going to be as much about, if not more, preventing rescues than actually performing them. Requiring any kind of training beyond OW before Rescue is silly if you don't have rescue skills in the OW class. What are two AOW divers supposed to do when the stuff hits the fan and they see a panicking diver at the surface or come across a non responsive one at depth?
Say "Oh my! We are not rescue divers! We must find one to help this poor sot!"

 

[TheHuth]

Jim, I'm trying to find information online about SEI. I'd like to see if there is any locations within driving distance from where I live

 

[Jim Lapenta]

Mostly because it will be a pre-requisite to getting Rescue Diver. It also opens up my limits from 60 feet to 100.

This is one of the primary reasons I hear for taking the class from AOW students. It's also the one that gives me the most pause when interviewing them.

What is at 100 ft that you have to get to so fast? I do understand it to a point. That was my main motivation early on. Looking back it was not a wise one as I truly did not understand the increased risks with doing this.

I can also state that they were not clearly explained either in the class with the degree of emphasis they should have been. It wasn't until I took NAUI Intro to Tech and Helitrox that I really began to understand the difference that 40 feet or so makes.

I still enjoy deep dives. IF there is something there to see. Deep for the sake of deep no longer holds the same fascination. Having a much clearer understanding of the risks is why the class I offer is set up the way it is and includes the things it does. Even so it does not prepare the diver fully to go out and start doing every deep dive they can right after the class. It gives them the tools to gradually increase their range over time with a consideration of the conditions, objective, and resources available. That is made as clear as possible during the class.

100 ft is not the same every time. Freshwater, cold water, salt, warm, high vis, low vis, etc all can drastically change the prep and equipment required. Maybe it's because I train primarily in colder water with lower vis that I feel these dives are actually conducted much safer than a 100 ft in the Caribbean. I see divers posting from Bonaire, Grand Cayman, Bahamas, etc about their 100 ft dives that seem to be taken with the same attention to detail and planning as a 30 ft reef dive. "We followed the DM and all of a sudden saw we were at 100 ft, looked around, came back up. Got close on air though! It was fun."

I don't see that up here. A 100 ft dive is not routine. It shouldn't be. In any conditions. Belize had to enact rules because of the crap going on at the Blue Hole. Even PADI jumped in on that.

Decide what it is that you need to get to 100 ft to see. Then ask yourself if it's worth the increased risk to yourself and your loved ones. Realizing that you are only going to have 10-15 minutes there. IF your air consumption is really good and you have a large enough tank.

 

[Jim Lapenta]

Jim, I'm trying to find information online about SEI. I'd like to see if there is any locations within driving distance from where I live

You need to call SEI HQ in Indiana. Realize that not all instructors teach this class the way I do. Most do not. I wrote this course myself and got approved to teach it. I don't know any other SEI Instructor that offers it.

Realize that the majority of SEI Instructors DO NOT teach for shops or own them. They are independent instructors that may use a shop for resources or have the gear themselves. Many teach through college or university programs. You are also fortunate in that you have the option of the L A County SCUBA Program in California. That's a training program I'd love to have available around here. Their Advanced Class will get you to where you want to be.

Bob Bailey (NW Grateful Diver) on here teaches his on the west coast. He's a NAUI Instructor.

Don't focus on the agency. Find an instructor that will tailor a course to you. Bob Arak in California is another I'd recommend. He's PADI but he goes beyond agency standards and will try to accommodate you to the best of his ability within the standards he needs to stay with.

You also have the option of doing non cert workshops with a number of instructors that will tailor them to you.

 

[TheHuth]

I am in no rush to be able to dive to 100'. Not at all. Hence the reason I am also in no rush to take AOW. Let me rephrase what I said. There are some boat dives that wont take you without the AOW cert. So I'd like to remove that restriction...eventually.

But much more importantly is that PADI wants you to have your AOW before taking the PADI rescue diver. I'm going to look in to the SEI courses though because I'd like to learn rescue as soon as possible.

One of the problems with these forums is there is no way for me to explain myself after I write the post. The whole reason I started this thread is to get input on continuing my training. I want to be a competent safe diver. I want to have fun. The last thing I want is to have a serious situation happen underwater.

 

[Bob DBF]

I did my AOW 29 years after my OW, I wouldn't suggest waiting that long.

Take your time, do some diving, and look for a class that will teach you something rather than just accompany you on five dives and give you a card. I wouldn't necessarily blow off your shop, but rather find out how they conduct the class and what they are going to teach you. Then compare that to others who run classes in the area.

Also you could talk to the dive club(s) in your area to help find a class you would like. There are a number of them on scubaboard that would probably help out.


Good Luck

Bob

 

[tye1138]

One of the big problems is the lack of decent education in many basic OW courses. Some instructors gloss over some critical things like PROPER buoyancy and weighting, expecting you to come back and learn those things properly at a later date. Not saying all instructors do this, but it's pretty common these days. The quality of your diving will change dramatically when you're buoyancy is right, which generally requires someone to teach you. Sure, you could figure it out on your own, but it can be tricky and maybe even risky if you aren't careful.

Hey, if you wanna go diving sometime, I'd be more then happy to help fine tune your skills.

 

[EFX]

I was on the fast track, completing OW refresh and the start of AOW all in one weekend. Since you are more comfortable practicing before taking the class I suggest you do that provided you actually work on skills. I would also suggest you buy the materials and study them and work toward the skills they describe. For example you mentioned buoyancy. This can be one of the specialties you need for AOW and reading the book will help prepare you for the class. Make sure you reach an understanding with the LDS and if you can, talk with the instructor you'll be taking the class from. Make sure s/he understands your timetable and goals so there are no hard feelings.

 

[fjpatrum]

The only answer is "it depends". If you're comfortable diving on your own, without supervision of a DM/instructor, then go dive. If you feel like you need a little more time with an experienced person to give you valid feedback and helpful instruction/hints/whatever, take the class immediately.

I have no intention of ever taking an AOW class and I've done deep dives (~100 fsw) night dives, wreck dives, drift dives, shore dives, you name it.

Any sales person that gives me high pressure sales tactics gets called on it right then and the shop manager/owner (if different) might also get a complaint from me. I don't deal with it well. I already know what I want and don't want, I don't need someone else to try and tell me.


EDIT: I haven't taken Jim Lapenta's class but it's the only one I've seriously considered. Very good course outline he gave me a couple years back. I can only imagine it has gotten better over time, given his reputation and his desire to produce quality divers.

EDIT 2: I have yet to find a boat that won't take me on a deep dive, even without an AOW. I have had several that said they might require me to hire a DM (not in southern CA) or do a checkout dive with them first, but never had one deny me outright.

 

[Lorenzoid]

I am in no rush to be able to dive to 100'. Not at all. Hence the reason I am also in no rush to take AOW. Let me rephrase what I said. There are some boat dives that wont take you without the AOW cert. So I'd like to remove that restriction...eventually.

But much more importantly is that PADI wants you to have your AOW before taking the PADI rescue diver. I'm going to look in to the SEI courses though because I'd like to learn rescue as soon as possible.

One of the problems with these forums is there is no way for me to explain myself after I write the post. The whole reason I started this thread is to get input on continuing my training. I want to be a competent safe diver. I want to have fun. The last thing I want is to have a serious situation happen underwater.

Have you considered the GUE Fundamentals course? It won't replace the unfortunate function of the AOW card as a prerequisite for certain boat dives, but it would help you become a "competent safe diver."