Halcyon Evolve JJ Wing to replace the standard wing?

[keysdvr]

How much gas is in your wings when diving these rigs? Can you shed weight somewhere? It doesn't sound like a very balanced rig if the wing is full or feeling full during normal operation. What if you lose the wing or have a flood? Is the solution really just a bigger wing?

If you're carrying two or three extra stages that are themselves negatively buoyant, a bigger wing in that case could still be able to provide another extra ~40lbs of emergency/contingency buoyancy on top of what's already in there. Are we talking about that?

What is the bottom temp? What is the undergarment? Which kinds of warm water types of dives is the GUE rig appropriate for?

Can't really shed any weight - might be able to switch from AL to CF BP, but I think the change would be minimal. Otherwise, the rig is what the rig is (I don't have any other weight onboard).

Diving in a Halo AR undergarment, from now (mid 60s F) down to the mid mid-high 40s, then I swap for a DUI Thinsulate 450. I was in a thin (150 wt) fleece jumpsuit when I had the wing almost fully inflated, with two battery cans, but zero extra stages.

I'm not diving a mega unit with four onboard cylinders, but the wing is mostly empty with 2x 3L's on board and two LP50 bailouts as stages with BZ400 unders, plus wing inflate, heating battery, torches etc. And that's with shrink-wrapped lead rods in the handle tubes. 10mm hood, RK3 (don't need a heavy jetfin..)

Curiously - are you using the stock JJ wing?

Thanks for the feedback and ideas though!

 

[keysdvr]

I replaced the standard wing with a Tecline wing. I'am diving the 'normal' JJ. Reason for me was that I could hardly keep my chin above water with multiple bail outs. Not nice in choppy conditions. The Tecline wing has slighly more buoyancy than the JJ wing, which raises me a little bit higher on the surface.

In my opnion the standard JJ wing is a little under dimensioned.

I think the JJ wing would be perfect for 2x 3L's, but agree that it's small if you have bigger mounted bottles. I'll have to look up the Tecline wing - thanks!

 

[keysdvr]

i dive a fathom but i recently switched from the original halcyon evolve jj wing (32 pounds of lift) to the new gusseted version (42 pounds of lift). I find it works pretty well even in fresh water with deco bottles. In the same configuration i found the original halcyon evolve jj wing would be filled to the brim and felt wobbily as a result

Thanks flymolo!

That's just what I was hoping - the (new) Evolve JJ w/ 42 lbs would be wider and wrap around the LP50s a little better than the stock JJ wing. With my drysuit and the Halo AR undergarments, I have more than enough lift, but think a wider wing would fit better and provide more balanced lift.

 

[211ratsbud]

This is a 40. Definitely doesn't not fit the 50's very well!

Keeping my eyes peeled for a 60 coming up second hand!

 

[flymolo]

Thanks flymolo!

That's just what I was hoping - the (new) Evolve JJ w/ 42 lbs would be wider and wrap around the LP50s a little better than the stock JJ wing. With my drysuit and the Halo AR undergarments, I have more than enough lift, but think a wider wing would fit better and provide more balanced lift.

I found the shape of both evolve jj wings worked well however I don’t know if 42lb is enough lift for the jj with back mounted bailout if carrying 2+ deco bottles in fresh water. the fathom is a bit lighter so it seems to work for that

 

[justinthedeeps]

Curiously - are you using the stock JJ wing?

Thanks for the feedback and ideas though!

I am just using the cool custom colored Halycon "doubles" wing I already had (Evolve 40?) and cut slits for passing hoses. It seems arguably sufficient since I was taught to balance the rig so you could still manage to swim around with a failed wing, or a filled wing with a flooded loop.

I guess it's fine to use the wing to adjust for up to a ~10-15 lbs difference based on conditions, just upsizing the wing so that you still have 40lbs of reserve buoyancy. I gather that is the general solution and actual basic answer in this thread. Just bringing up the 'balanced rig' thing because it probably can help.

There is a ~3kg (6-7lb) weight difference between my JJ stock plate/harness vs. the carbon plate/harness, and that steel is nearly as dense as lead.

Density of the rig definitely increases with each piece of steel and brass.
Alum cylinders are not actually 'lighter' just less dense. But twin Al40 dilouts could be both a bit lighter AND ~2+lbs (each) more buoyant than twin (overfilled) LP50s?

There other matter here of course is that those big dilout cylinders impede where the wing was supposed to be in the stock config--hence wider wings that stay empty where the cylinders now intrude.
The 'heavy' onboard dilout config does seem nice in that there is one less stage to faff around with.

If diving tropical/suitless maybe these~7-litre '4500psi' carbon cylinders weighing ~9lbs? ("Snorkeling?" lol )

 

[Matan]

Hi.
Currently diving my JJ in GUE config - 2x LP50s, 2x 3L. Using the standard JJ wing, but considering getting the Halcyon Evolve JJ wing. If you have one - are you happy with it?

I have the H JJ wing - Much nicer for the GUE config.

I've switched to an AL BP, but with a steel BP and thin undergarments the current wing feels very 'full' and a bit constricted between my back/hips and the tanks. I'm concerned that when adding a deco bottle, it'll be the same despite AL BP and heavier garments. Debating the Halcyon with 42 lbs of lift ('only' 2 lbs more lift than the standard, but wider to accommodate the LP50s?). Very leary of jumping to a much larger wing (ie. 60lb Scubapro or similar).

Thanks!
Michael

If you're heavy - get a CF backplate, and you can change the suit cylinder to a carbon one as well (those are literally floats).

The H JJ wing should be ok unless you're super heavy in which case it's a rig issue not a wing issue.

For comparison here in Israel during summer (water 31C in the shallows) I dive w/o any suit - just impossible to dive the GUE configuration --> revert to original JJ (and even than I go CF BP + carbon dil/O2 cylinder).


p.s. for the regular JJ config just use the regular JJ wing which is awesome.

Matan.

 

[RedSix]

Weight difference between aluminum and CF backplates is roughly 230g (see Halcyon, standard aluminum bp is 770g, standard CF is 540g). Density is ~2.7 g/cm³ for aluminum, 1.8 g/cm³ for CF. So the volume of the aluminum BP is ~285cm³, CF has ~300cm³.
This results in a difference of ~250g in buoyancy. IMHO negligible..

 

[Fat old english bloke]

Weight difference between aluminum and CF backplates is roughly 230g (see Halcyon, standard aluminum bp is 770g, standard CF is 540g). Density is ~2.7 g/cm³ for aluminum, 1.8 g/cm³ for CF. So the volume of the aluminum BP is ~285cm³, CF has ~300cm³.
This results in a difference of ~250g in buoyancy. IMHO negligible..

I have carbon for the looks though.