Got My DM - But I Don't Want to Dive "This Way"...

[Thalassamania]

... has anyone?

Frankly no. Let's close the thread and move on?

 

[Jim Lapenta]

I have to say that I have. I've learned that there are alot of people who buy into the welfare of the shop comes before the students BS. Who think that a DM who is uncomfortable in their gear and is quite possibly distracted by that is no big deal. I do not understand the shop not wanting DM's to use their rental gear even if they sell it. As for loaning gear out I'm very careful who I loan my gear out to. Even though it is serviced regularly and in excellent shape it only takes one incident for a student, or worse their heirs, to hire some shyster and put me out of business or at least make things very uncomfortable for me. If they insist you dive your own gear then you should determine what that is.

This stuff about confusing students with different configurations is a joke. If anything I've found that different gear setups promote questions, which lead to discussions, which lead to sales. The only ones who lose out are the shops that are so locked into certain modes that anything else is junk or "to tech". The one shop I worked with is like that. BPW, long hose, can lights, etc have no place in recreational diving. I no longer help out there for that reason among others. I've learned that those who refuse to change and adapt are the most threatened by those of us who are open to new things, are willing to take a chance, to try new things and find that if they make sense stick with them even when lots of other folks are saying BS like long hoses have no use in recreational diving, can lights are a waste of money, and that BPW's push you face first into the water.

As long as the agencies continue to promote one way of doing things as the only way and the shops buy into it, it falls on those of us who prefer to align with progressive shops who are willing to try new things and with agencies that not only allow but encourage free thinking and to put the needs of the students ahead of the shops and the agencies. As a YMCA Instructor I'm obligated by standards to base my gear recommendations to students based on their needs, type of diving they plan to do, and their means to pay for it. I can't recommend a 500 dollar reg when what will really serve them at the time is a 300 dollar one. If I know for a fact that they have every intention of going tech or doing alot of traveling and based on my experience and their needs and wants feel a BPW is the way to go I'll not recommend a jacket bc for their first one.Being affiliated with a shop yet not actually an employee is a highly desirable position for me. Also being in the area I'm at allows me to teach independently thru another lds. Though only 50 miles apart the clientele do not cross over and instead of competing with each other the shops actually cooperate and complement each other.

For what it's worth Peter again take Bob up on his offer and the other as well. If you want to be independent do so. Align yourself with those who will allow you to as well. It makes all the difference in the world. Believe me. I almost chucked it all do to being locked to one way of thinking and getting disgusted with it. I'm glad I met and aligned with those who allow me the freedom to let my ethics, morals, and values guide my teaching and take the best interests of the students first and foremost.

 

[OneBrightGator]

I've learned that there are too many instructors and DMs who put WAY too much emphasis on equipment. Which really is just means to an end and certainly not something to rest your morals, ethics, religious beliefs, values, sexual orientation, merit or intestinal fortitude on. Get over yourselves.

 

[nereas]

Well, there are a lot of comments here that aren't very pertinent to Peter's situation. He's never going to work as a dive guide anywhere, and he's not worried about tips (nobody tips DMs who work with classes in our area, only the ones that work on boats). He got his DM so he could help out with OW classes, and not really for any other reason. I think he was also hoping to be able to bring a little diversity of technique and equipment so the students would get to see a wider variety of approaches. But having to give clients his gear and keep them happy really isn't in the equation at all.

Actually Peter sounds like a typical "new" D/M discovering the real world of retail scuba, and wondering what he has gotten himself into.

The main benefit of being a D/M is for the D/M him/herself. As a D/M you have thus become a one-on-one type instructor of dive students, under the general supervision of a scuba instructor, and therefore your own technique is now essentially flawless, and therefore you are become a role model. And so Peter has herewith become a flawless diver and a role model.

That is why the gear issue becomes so important. Ergo a role model is also a gear model.

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

For what it's worth Peter again take Bob up on his offer and the other as well. If you want to be independent do so. Align yourself with those who will allow you to as well. It makes all the difference in the world. Believe me. I almost chucked it all do to being locked to one way of thinking and getting disgusted with it. I'm glad I met and aligned with those who allow me the freedom to let my ethics, morals, and values guide my teaching and take the best interests of the students first and foremost.

FWIW - I'm not the NAUI instructor who offered Peter a crossover ... but I was out diving today with the one who did.

Peter, my advice is take him up on his offer. Besides getting to dive the way you want and use the gear you want, you'll learn a lot of things you didn't get to learn in your previous DM class.

A lot of you guys are pointing out the reasons why I won't teach for a lot of shops ... I refuse to put my students in junk gear, and I refuse to wear it myself. It has nothing to do with capabilities ... it has everything to do with comfort. You put students in gear that fits poorly, or functions poorly and you know what they do? They struggle through the class ... then decide diving's not for them and go find something else to do.

With attitudes like that, no wonder diving's got such a high drop-out rate.

I don't have any problem at all loaning my gear to students ... that's why I've got so much of it. But when I do ... they get backplates with high/quality wings sized appropriately to the type of diving they're doing.. They get regs that are high-performance and properly serviced. And the class isn't over until I'm satisfied they can use it with some degree of comfort and ability.

That's why the vast majority of my students keep diving ... most quite actively.

If you guys think you're doing yourselves ... or your LDS owners ... any favors by settling for ill-fitting, poorly-functioning gear ... either on yourselves or your students ... you're kidding yourselves. If the customer ain't comfortable, they're gonna quickly decide to go find something else to do with their recreational time and money ... that ain't my idea of a job well done.

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[Thalassamania]

Peter, do it and see if he'll do Master Diver with you first (that's the way it should go anyway) you'll wind up with the book knowledge of a NAUI Instructor and a great leadership program to boot.

 

[Skull]

Great points Bob ... the proper tools and proper maintained tools for the job at hand(substitute gear). Anything less leads to frustration, disappointment and ..possibly disaster.

 

[sed6]

I just completed the confined water portion of my OW training Friday night. For this pool session we had a substitute instructor as the regular instructor was teaching a Rescue Diver course in the other end of the pool. The substitued instructor, just like the regular instructor, wore the exact same gear as the students.

I found this interesting for a number of reasons. First I thought, knew, that the substitute instructor, and the regular instructor for that matter, have their own dive gear which is likely better, more comfortable and more expensive than the training gear. That they both wear the training gear with no apparant worry is either a testament to their own adaptability, or a testament to the high quality of even the 'low end' training gear we see (or both). Either way seeing this gave me confidence in both the gear we used and the instructors. Second, in this last session I was down to about 300psi with one more skill to demonstrate. The instructor quickly switched rigs with me so I could complete it without having to get another tank. Having the same equipment as the students is what allowed him to do so.

And lastly I suppose, while I didn't read the whole 11 pages, so it might have been mentioned, there is the whole "I'm paying you to teach a class, you'll wear what I want you to wear" arguement to consider.

-Scott
OKC, OK

 

[Thalassamania]

... And lastly I suppose, while I didn't read the whole 11 pages, so it might have been mentioned, there is the whole "I'm paying you to teach a class, you'll wear what I want you to wear" arguement to consider.

-Scott
OKC, OK

Your observations are good, but the last one is what the discussion is really about. If anyone ever ordered me to do something like that I'd quit immediately. I'm a teacher, not a salesman. If you want salesmen (rather than a teacher) to help you learn how to survive in a potentially deadly environment ... be my guest. I would find that foolish, rather like hiring a candy counter clerk to head a nutritional effects on cancer study.

 

[El Orans]

He's never going to work as a dive guide anywhere, and he's not worried about tips (nobody tips DMs who work with classes in our area, only the ones that work on boats). He got his DM so he could help out with OW classes, and not really for any other reason. I think he was also hoping to be able to bring a little diversity of technique and equipment so the students would get to see a wider variety of approaches. But having to give clients his gear and keep them happy really isn't in the equation at all.

Have you been reading my mind?

DMs get no tips here at all.

And lastly I suppose, while I didn't read the whole 11 pages, so it might have been mentioned, there is the whole "I'm paying you to teach a class, you'll wear what I want you to wear" argument to consider.

Payment? What payment?

I'll probably start my DM class in 6 months or so, depending on the number of candidates the LDS gets. But it will be done solely because I want to, not because of any non-existent payment. I've got my day job to provide that.