Going digital, what to buy?

[notabob]

Guess everyone has their favorites. Canon makes some very nice cameras that take awesome pics underwater. Their S series 3 and 4 megapixel cameras (S30, S40, & S45) are your low cost alternative, since Canon also makes a housing that fits all three and costs <$200. S40 has the same sensor and a lot of the same innards as the G2. The S45 is the same, but similar to the newer G3. G2 has consistently been rated on top of the 3-5MP range of cameras (at least in most comparison tests, albeit not in all), beating out the Olys and Nikons. The only limitation of the G2 is the lack of OEM housing for it and the need to buy the more expensive Ikelite (or one of the other alternatives). Canon also makes a housing for their 2MP camera, the A40. That one is significantly cheaper, but if you're just starting out on the digital path, you'll probably want to skip 2MP in favor of higher resolution.

With all of that said, Olympus cameras have become more popular for UW use, due to increased availability of a cheap(er) housing for their top end cameras (the Cx0x0 series). You will also likely find more users using the Olys and thus more readily available answers to your questions. Nikons are somewhere in there as well. They make very nice cameras that take some very nice shots as well, but no OEM housings. So all your housing options are once again $$$.

-Roman.

 

[DanL]

Definitely look at the Olympus C5050 and the matched Oly housing. Reviews are great, all the Cx0x0 earlier versions have been pretty darn good, and best of all - housing and cam less than $1000 from e-tailers.
Uses AA batts and 3 different types of storage media.
See review at dpreview.com

 

[raxafarian]

bholbertii once bubbled...
If you haven't bought one yet, I'd really consider the Canon G2 with the Ikelite housing. both for under $1200 and if you have the change, go with the strobe with the ikelite. You'll love the pics you get from the G2. No Nikon or Olympus will beat it. If you need a cheeper housing, look at www.aquatix.com and check out their housings. They make one for both digital and video and they are reasonable. I have the video housing and get great results. As far as lights go, I getting ready to try the Ocean Brite Led lites. Will let you know how they work. Good luck!

I'd rank all three about the same (nikon, olympus, canon), and put the sony dsc-717 in there too. Different features on each will appeal to different people. There's certainly no basic claiming canon is the best. If you're going to recommend the canon, at least recommend the G3.... they fixed several issues the G2 has, and added some lacking features.

Those LED lights are supposed to be ok above water, but suck underwater. They don't focus enough to penetrate the water more than a very short distance. All the LED lights I've seen give a very nice spread out light pattern, but it doesn't travel far (even above water).

 

[notabob]

raxafarian once bubbled...
Those LED lights are supposed to be ok above water, but suck underwater. They don't focus enough to penetrate the water more than a very short distance. All the LED lights I've seen give a very nice spread out light pattern, but it doesn't travel far (even above water).

I'd have to disagree somewhat. For underwater night photography you rarely need to penetrate very far. I used 2 3-LED, 4AAA Attitude lights together as my UW aiming lights, and they gave a very nice, white lights with a beautiful wide spread, and no hotspots whatsoever. Seemed to work extremely well, at least to me. Granted, they couldn't penetrate further than about 20ft in pretty clear water, but for night underwater photography I can't imagine you needing much more. I'm not sure how far a more powerful LED light would penetrate.

-Roman.

*Edited: Brain-farted in the initial post. I wasn't 2nd-ing, I was "disagreeing somewhat"

 

[raxafarian]

notabob once bubbled...
G2 has consistently been rated on top of the 3-5MP range of cameras (at least in most comparison tests, albeit not in all), beating out the Olys and Nikons

what reviews?


Every review I've seen compares all the 4-5mp cameras to the sony, and none can touch the sony's resolution.

There are pros and cons to every camera. Everyone will weigh those pros and cons differently. You can't make a blanket statement about what is the "best" camera. I waited for the G2 to be released when I was shopping for a camera, and after finally getting to try one, I handed it back after 5 minutes... it didn't do anything better than the other cameras I was looking at, and I didn't like the way it 'felt'.

I won't tell somebody what camera to get.... I will list pros and cons for them to consider, or point them to reviews so they can pick a camera that is right for them.

There are compromises in every camera, and the individual should be the one to decide where they want to compromise. I would recommend the best camera, cost aside, is the new canon eos 1ds. Nothing else comes close. The only con is the cost. All the so-called "prosumer" cameras all have strengths and weaknesses.

I'm not bashing your G2, just saying it wasn't the camera for me. If you are looking for a camera, you may rank the pros and cons differently, so a camera that one person feels is best, might not be best for another person.


I think a better way to help somebody decide on a camera, is list what appeals to you about that camera. Also list some of the cons. This will allow that person to make a more informed decision.

The person looking for a camera should list features they want. How much they want to spend. Things that would be turn-offs, etc.

If cost is a deciding factor, then the olympus 5050 jumps to the top of the heap. The canons that also have a manufacturers housing available are the "mid" to "lower" end models. These (S40, etc) are some of the lowest cost cameras available to use u/w. Put the sony P9 in this category.

If cost is not a deciding factor, then you must decide what features are important to you. The olympus 5050 will still need to be considered here. Now you can also consider the cameras that require a non-manufacturers housing. These would be the Nikon 5000, the canon G3, and the sony dsc-707/717.

I think I got most of the current models. There are probably some bargains to be had that will still yield acceptable results. Nikon 995 (although, due to housing cost, I wouldn't recommend). The G2 (again... due to housing cost, not recommended). The older olympus models... 4040, 3040. The cheapest used would probably be the canon A40, the sony p5, etc.


Next, you would jump up to the digital SLR's (and a big jump it is)... canon d60. Nikon D100. Fuji S2. Kodak ??. And some others.

I might have missed some model #'s, so don't get pissed if I didn't list your favorite camera

 

[raxafarian]

notabob once bubbled...


I'd have to disagree somewhat. For underwater night photography you rarely need to penetrate very far. I used 2 3-LED, 4AAA Attitude lights together as my UW aiming lights, and they gave a very nice, white lights with a beautiful wide spread, and no hotspots whatsoever. Seemed to work extremely well, at least to me. Granted, they couldn't penetrate further than about 20ft in pretty clear water, but for night underwater photography I can't imagine you needing much more. I'm not sure how far a more powerful LED light would penetrate.

-Roman.

*Edited: Brain-farted in the initial post. I wasn't 2nd-ing, I was "disagreeing somewhat"

I was "ass"uming that he was gonna use these to actually light the scene, not for aiming. How did they affect your color? Not sure what temp their light is, but I know it's not daylight or regular strobe.

 

[bholbertii]

Guess I created a great debate over my recommending the G2. But, I'd like to digress to "What I Actually Said". "No Nikon or Olympus will beat it". Allow me to clarify ... I didn't say it was better or the best but that none of the others would beat it ... meaning performance. And as my backup I'd like to refer (as one source) to "Digital Photography Review" http://www.dpreview.com Like someone has said ... we all have our preferences on what we like. I've had and tried Canons, Nikons, and Sonys. When I was in the market for the new digital camera I read every review I could find and talked to at least 5 camera stores, including Wolf, Pro Camera and others and the G2 got top marks from all of them. DPReview gave the G3/G2 higher marks than the Olympus 5050 and so did every camera shop I talked to. However, my final decision came down to what I liked in my own two hands ... and that was the G2 (G3 not out yet when I bought the G2). Again I'd like to emphasize that I did not say it was the best but that it can't be beat by the others in overall performance ... in or out of the water. My regards to those of you who get so excited.

 

[bholbertii]

Glad I threw in that little bit about buying the LED lights. Price being a factor for me, the LEDs appeared to be something to try. The UK Light Cannon is rated at 6000-degrees and the LEDs at 5500 degrees. I was looking for something that would give a good white light within 10 feet to get better color shots at depth. From my reviews for all kinds of lights, from $500 to $3000 it looked like the HIDs would be the best if money was no issue. But since it was, I was willing to give them a try. They may not be the best but the burn time, price and 5500 degree temp sounded like they at least deserved a chance. I'll be leaving for Belize in a few weeks and will post the results once I get back.

 

[notabob]

What bholbertii said... The G2 (and now G3) have very often edged out competition, at least for land use. I haven't read the latest crop of camera reviews, I'm sure there're some new players. At the time when I was purchasing mine, last May, G2 appeared to be the measuring stick for all others, based on a few months research and numerous reviews & comparisons (dpreview & various others, I didn't keep the links from back then).

But as Rax said, nothing is for everyone. G2/G3, while great cameras, have their weak points as well. Some don't like the shape or controls. They are known to be a little more susceptible to noise at high ISO settings. The built-in strobe is weak (but then again, just about all cameras suffer from that). But in many other parameters, they are (or at least were, very recently) superior to the competition. Sharpness, color representation, etc. I already listed their weaknesses for UW use in a previous message.

When people ask questions about a better camera, responses will typically be subjective. What works for one person, may not for another. And people are naturally more familiar with a particular camera that they own (and sometimes more biased . That's human nature). Hence, their recommendations will often be based on their own experiences. Many of us here will also often mention other cameras as well, acknowledging their better suitability for a particular function or application. Ultimately, as it's already been said, it is up to the person seeking the information to sort out all the data that they were able to gather, opinions, facts, etc. and then make up their mind based on that.

-Roman.

 

[notabob]

raxafarian once bubbled...
I was "ass"uming that he was gonna use these to actually light the scene, not for aiming. How did they affect your color? Not sure what temp their light is, but I know it's not daylight or regular strobe.

I was using them as aiming lights and as my dive light. Worked pretty well, except for distance. The light is very white (as bholbertii said, in the 5000s). Colors were pretty realistic, I thought. I little soft, maybe, but I liked it.

http://home.att.net/~dracko/bonaire/parrot-night.jpg

http://home.att.net/~dracko/bonaire/lobster-night.jpg

http://home.att.net/~dracko/bonaire/anemone-night.jpg

-Roman.