Fire on dive boat Conception in CA

[tbird2020]

I hate to even speculate a little on this before more information is released, but for those who have stayed on the boat, are the cabins lockable from the outside?
I find it odd yet obviously terrible that not a single person made it out, especially those nearest the exits. Alarms would have gone off, at least one person would have smelled the smoke and been awake. I don't think possibility of foul play should be ignored.

 

[broncobowsher]

I am sure the twin towers had proper evacuation plans in case of fire within. What turned twin towers into death traps was an attack from outside that injected tons of burning jet fuel inside the buildings. To make your analogy working you need some evidence of an outside attack on Conception, like with an anti-ship missile.

But the twin towers were engineered to take a plane strike. It happened before in NYC when a bomber hit the empire state building. But the standards for the twin towers were a lost plane, low on fuel. Remember that when the twin towers were built navigation was mostly visual, radio navigation, star charts. No modern GPS of today. So a lost plane (I think it was planned for a 707) looking for an airport was a very plausible thing to plan for. What happened was a plane strike (actually two) that were in excess of what the engineers planned for. Larger planes with a full fuel load. Can you fault the engineers who engineered the building for not calculating that there would be bigger planes loaded with fuel run into the buildings? Can you fault the building inspectors as the building was built and maintained that times had changed? Meets all codes and inspections.

To that I will say the boat was engineered for a fire. A small one. Given the vintage of the boat, probably just a cigarette fire. If you don't remember back a few decades, smoking was a very common thing that a lot of people did. Smoking sections in commercial airliners (watch the movie Airplane sometime). Restaurants were a place to light up after a meal, except for the non-smoking section. Later that reversed and it was the smoking section before smoking was just banned. What happened, well we still don't know, but it didn't match the original plans that it would just be a small fire. The fully loaded airliner hit instead of the smaller one that was on fumes.

You can't live thinking that the law passed yesterday applies to things that happened years before. My 1977 truck is completely legal. Doesn't pass any modern safety standards. No airbags, no ABS, no electronic stability system, no brake interlock. This stuff is law on modern just built vehicles. Are you saying that every car, truck, plane, boat needs to go back and be retrofitted with the latest engineering every time a standard gets tougher?

POST EDITED by Moderators

 

[MichaelMc]

I hate to even speculate a little on this before more information is released, but for those who have stayed on the boat, are the cabins lockable from the outside?
I find it odd yet obviously terrible that not a single person made it out, especially those nearest the exits. Alarms would have gone off, at least one person would have smelled the smoke and been awake. I don't think possibility of foul play should be ignored.

MINOR EDIT by Moderators.
The stairs from the berthing to the galley/salon are open. They have no door. Please read what has been released before speculating. Better yet, wait for the NTSB report.

 

[KevinNM]

I hate to even speculate a little on this before more information is released, but for those who have stayed on the boat, are the cabins lockable from the outside?
I find it odd yet obviously terrible that not a single person made it out, especially those nearest the exits. Alarms would have gone off, at least one person would have smelled the smoke and been awake. I don't think possibility of foul play should be ignored.

There are no cabins. It’s one open area with no door on the stairs going up.

 

[Bob DBF]

NOTE: A LOT OF CONJECTURE ABOUT THE CONCEPTION SEEMS TO BE COMING FROM A VIDEO POSTED IN POST #275 (page 28). THIS IS A VIDEO OF THE VISION, NOT THE CONCEPTION.

Vision and Conception are sister ships, made from the same plans, there are only cosmetic differences.

. And, I distinctly recall it not drying well. Leading cause of dryers not drying well is vent partial or complete obstruction.

Using damp air and trying to dry wet towels is futile. I started bringing a towel foer each day, and backups for anything else I might have to dry.

If the clothes weren’t dry, I don’t think the dryer would shut off due to the moisture sensing system. Could have been started at midnight and easily run 3-4 hours.

The boats use a regular electric dryer and shut off in an hour or so max.

I think I am sane, you will surely disagree. I am scheduled to go out on a two-day trip on the Truth (the first boat of this operator) in two weeks. I am sure that trip will be cancelled. If it wasn’t cancelled I would go. Just like I still go into skyscrapers or ride in airplanes.

I'm with you. Also, the Truth has a different layout than the other two Truth Aquatics boats.

Neither exit took them to exterior deck space without going through the galley which was engulfed.

There are knock out windows at the forward end of the lounge / galley compartment, so one could exit from either end of the compartment.


Bob

 

[MichaelMc]

Forgive me if I missed this being posted upthread, but here's an interview with the owner of Truth Aquatics...

DoctorMike, Thank you for posting this! It is an informative interview.

 

[NickB-LA]

I hate to even speculate a little on this before more information is released, but for those who have stayed on the boat, are the cabins lockable from the outside?
I find it odd yet obviously terrible that not a single person made it out, especially those nearest the exits. Alarms would have gone off, at least one person would have smelled the smoke and been awake. I don't think possibility of foul play should be ignored.

There are no cabins, just a bunk room with no doors and an open stairway to the galley and an escape hatch. There would be no way to lock people in even if someone was intent on doing so. MINOR EDIT by Moderators.

(note to moderators: I'm not trying to be confrontational, just trying to get to the point and I appreciate your efforts to keep things civil)

 

[roman50]

So you are one of the 5 surviving crew or were on the neighboring vessel?

If not
You have no idea what started this or how "extreme" it was.

I believe the crew had no idea either. Looking at the layout of the boat the bridge is connected with the main deck through the external stairs in the back. So there is no direct connection with the galley. The question is whether there were any smoke detectors in galley for obvious reasons (smoke from food preparation). So if there weren't it's not hard to imagine small fire (from said li-ion charging) spreading out and watch crew even if they haven't been asleep having absolutely no idea what's going on down below until too late.

Listen I am not bashing anyone and it's obvious that many people out there have strong connection to boat operator. But this scenario can repeat itself on any of remaining boats of this design and operation tomorrow.

 

[MichaelMc]

Listen I am not bashing anyone and it's obvious that many people out there have strong connection to boat operator. But this scenario can repeat itself on any of remaining boats of this design and operation tomorrow.

Yes, what ever the issue was can repeat itself tomorrow. Though not in this fleet as they have put themself in stand down to respect the families, see the interview posted above. Any other reputable operator will be hyper alert right now. And the NTSB is on this. They will find the likely cause and publish their findings.

I have no connection that operator. I have wanted to dive with them. I hope to later this year.

 

[HalcyonDaze]

I believe the crew had no idea either. Looking at the layout of the boat the bridge is connected with the main deck through the external stairs in the back. So there is no direct connection with the galley. The question is whether there were any smoke detectors in galley for obvious reasons (smoke from food preparation). So if there weren't it's not hard to imagine small fire (from said li-ion charging) spreading out and watch crew even if they haven't been asleep having absolutely no idea what's going on down below until too late.

Listen I am not bashing anyone and it's obvious that many people out there have strong connection to boat operator. But this scenario can repeat itself on any of remaining boats of this design and operation tomorrow.

There have been references made to both heat and smoke detectors onboard. Additionally, if you look at an external picture of the vessel it becomes clear that while the exits emerge into the same space (stairs at the front and emergency exit in the rear, just a few feet from the exit onto the deck), there is a large amount of distance separating them - a third the overall length of the vessel or more. If both exits were blocked by fire that would indicate a significant portion of the vessel was in flames by that point; I find it rather hard to imagine it progressed from a "small" fire to that over an extended period without the crew noticing something. Additionally, a few posts have shown examples of an Li-ion battery blowing up; it's not a particularly small fire - more like having a Roman candle light off, with a blinding ignition.