Fire on dive boat Conception in CA

[Texas Torpedo]

Perhaps Lithium batteries need special charging surfaces/containers etc to protect against said failures.

Or as I noted last night, maybe you end all charging before people go to sleep. Add a buffer if there is a latent failure possibility for some duration after charging has ended.

A significant number of remote control model airfields (and r/c car tracks) require all LiPo's to be charged in a fire containment bag, regardless of battery capacity, even if you are sitting there monitoring the charge. It can be a PITA to remove batteries out of an air frame when you could just run extended charge leads into the aircraft, but there's a reason.

Here is what we use...
https://www.amazon.com/s?k=lipo+bags&ref=nb_sb_noss

Not trying to beat the heck out of the LiPo issue.. I just think a lot of divers aren't up to speed on these batteries.

 

[NickB-LA]

Is this 'battery farm' style of boat common in the US? I've never seen anything like it before, up to 46 people sleeping under the galley, with stairs leading to the galley, one hatch leading the front of the galley and another hatch leading to the back of the galley. And darkness

It is in California. It's the norm for long range, overnight fishing and dive boats here. It's really not the oppressive "battery farm" situation that it appears. The bunk rooms are certainly not spacious. But they are not meant to be, nor are they expected to be. They aren't meant to be cabins where you hangout in your quarters. They are simply a place to sleep and rest up for the next day of diving. Virtually everyone on the boat spends all of their waking hours on the boat either on deck or in the galley and hanging out with their fellow divers. This style of boat is one of several reasons that California diving is very different than other places in the world. I have been fortunate enough to have spent time on LOBs around the world with different styles of accommodations and service and they have all been great at what they are. But California diving and the boats and crews that got me there are easily amongst my favorite style of diving.

 

[Ron Lee]

Not trying to beat the heck out of the LiPo issue.. I just think a lot of divers aren't up to speed on these batteries.

I know that my knowledge of them is limited.

It sounds to me like charging these in a home could be equally dangerous. Are Li-Po what was used in many of the hover boards that reportedly went up in flame? Were these cheap foreign made batteries of questional quality?

Maybe I misunderstood your post. Sounded like you were saying the owner uses this as a get out of jail free card and doesn’t make changes if necessary. That may not have been your point, apologies if it wasn’t.

That said, to this post there is a rule in law that prohibits the introduction of subsequent remedial measures as proof of liability. Ie you knew that design that caused my injury was unsafe and you changed it to make it safer. This is a policy decision that encourages changes to be made without fear that’s it’s being used against them. Otherwise they wouldn’t be made

Great. That was my question even if poorly worded. Now I understand it and if they make changes in response to a previously unexpected threat, it won't be used against them.

 

[broncobowsher]

You have to wonder if with this mindset they will do nothing to reduce future risk should a similar event happen again.

Because the legal system is broken. Add in California and it is even more broken.
The same thing happened in the Las Vegas shooting.

I've done mostly West coast boats and like how they are run. I just did an East coast boat and that was one that felt like every penny was pinched to the limit. I remember hearing a comment before I went that if you want to be popular on a dive boat bring some good cookies. That didn't make any sense to me since the California boats all end the day with a big tray of good cookies. Go East, you feel lucky they have water available to drink on board. California you get something close to a meal between dives. Back East, hope you packed something yourself. There is a big difference in how dive boats run in different parts of the country.

 

[doctormike]

Totally off topic, but I have to defend East Coast wreck diving. Can you tell me where your East coast dive was?

 

[HalcyonDaze]

Did I ever say one chainsaw for each bed? The answer is no.

Reality (even though this was probably never anticipated) is that had one been available and safely usable then dozens of people may not have died.

Or, with a big battery/charging station for said chainsaw, we could be investigating that as a possible source for the fire.

Seriously, stick to something that isn't another likely source of death/injury. I could agree with alterations like removing the bunks under the emergency escape and/or direct access into the shower area and putting a second escape hatch onto the forward deck there. Do I think it would have made a difference in this case? Maybe the second option might have, but likely not much of a one.

I saw the updated account, which slightly changes my understanding of how events unfolded (I had previously thought the bridge crew jumped directly into the water and reboarded from the rear; now it appears they jumped down to the forward deck first and tried to get in through the front windows but were blocked by fire). I expect I will have to revise other assumptions as more information comes in. From the report that the flames prevented the crew from getting down the rear stairway but the bridge and foredeck were habitable at the time, it would seem the fire was present throughout the galley at the time but worst at the rear.

I still think the galley is the most likely start location for the fire. Unless a fire in the bunkroom brewed up fast enough to incapacitate everyone in short order, I would think it would have been detected by someone in time for at least one emergency exit to be used.

 

[Bob DBF]

This article suggests there was no watchmen.

The article is behind a paywall, so could you enlighten me about how they came to that conclusion.


Thanks

Bob

 

[KevinNM]

Unless a fire in the bunkroom brewed up fast enough to incapacitate everyone in short order, I would think it would have been detected by someone in time for at least one emergency exit to be used.

More likely the assortment of highly toxic chemicals from a slow smoldering fire would have killed or incapacitated everyone before it burst into flame if the smoke alarm failed to go off. Some 30-40 pages pack someone went over the horrific assortment of chemicals that get created.

 

[KevinNM]

https://www.latimes.com/california/story/2019-09-05/california-boat-fire-victims-crew-members-passengers?_amp=true

This article suggests there was no watchmen.

"A crew member was awake on the boat and straightening up items in the galley and mess area but went upstairs to the wheelhouse about 2:35 a.m.

"Before the crew member went upstairs, he checked that the stove was cold and nothing flammable was out, said the source, who spoke on the condition of anonymity because he was not authorized to comment publicly. Sometime between 2:35 a.m. and 3:15 a.m., the crew member heard a noise and thought somebody had tripped. The crew member went down to the middle level and saw the fire. The flames prevented him from getting down into the galley, the source said."

 

[Honokai]

I know you didn’t. Judgment is certainly out there. See the post above this one.

Just explaining the practicalities of the process

The point you made along with so many others is why I always seek forums like this when these kind of events occur.

Journalism is really a horrible profession at this point. I have no respect for the news reporting business. It would be extremely rare for news reporter to point out that the insurance company makes this type of filing as a matter of course. Is the reporter being dishonest? No. But the news report is being written to generate sensationalism and hate. The reporters that write this don’t see themselves as despicable... but I do.