Well, if you can recommend some liveaboards and dive centers in Egypt where such things are unheard of I'm sure such information would be useful for many people.
Elphinstone - what is it like in late october?
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Well, if you can recommend some liveaboards and dive centers in Egypt where such things are unheard of I'm sure such information would be useful for many people.
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JustSurfaceInterval
Contributor
Adding to above without mentioning James& Mac and Extra Divers again 
Lagona Divers (Dahab), Orca Dive (all), Red Sea Diving Safari (Marsa Shagra, Marsa Nakari)
Can you name the ops with whom you had your bad experience?
Lagona Divers (Dahab), Orca Dive (all), Red Sea Diving Safari (Marsa Shagra, Marsa Nakari)
Can you name the ops with whom you had your bad experience?
I believe I already mentioned Millenium (Sharm branch). Another operation that has general positive reviews but failed to deliver (but perhaps given the circumstances would be unfair to be discussed in detail) was Emperor during the Covid. I'm not sure however that the experience should be blamed on the company or rather on the employees during hard times so I'd leave it like this. On a Snefro boat I've had the "let's not do last dive" thing.
The list goes on and on.
From your list, I did some shore based dives with with Umbi and I can confirm that what was agreed was delivered. But my impression was that this was mostly due to me running into a really great guide who tried to do things the right way. (as in there were were some attempts by other staff but when I mentioned it to him he sorted things out real fast.
Now, looking to the Extra Divers website Dive Safari: MY Red Sea Explorer / Egypt I see stuff like this:
Exclusive:
- Egypt entry visa € 30, - per person (payable locally)
- Flight to Marsa Alam or Hurghada
- Local Fees € 220,- per person and tour for 7-day trips (payable locally)
- canned drinks and alcohol
- diving courses (on request, pre-booking required)
- equipment rental (on request, pre-booking required)
- € 40, - per week for 15 litre tanks
I'm sure that if you're paying 30 euros for the visa that costs 25$ at the bank kiosk or 40 euros per week for 15L air tanks, or 170 euros per full equipment per week they probably won't try anything else. I mean seriously, was talking about companies that try to do shenanigans after you haggle them down to realistic prices.
Just to make clear what I'm talking about: if you pay 40 euros per week for 15L they will probably give you 15L Nitrox without asking for extra money (really greedy ones will try to charge on top of that). However if you haggle them down to 5$ per diving day for 15L and forget to mention Nitrox, you bet it's going to be an air tank and you'll be asked for extra money onboard if you want 15L Nitrox.
The list goes on and on.
From your list, I did some shore based dives with with Umbi and I can confirm that what was agreed was delivered. But my impression was that this was mostly due to me running into a really great guide who tried to do things the right way. (as in there were were some attempts by other staff but when I mentioned it to him he sorted things out real fast.
Now, looking to the Extra Divers website Dive Safari: MY Red Sea Explorer / Egypt I see stuff like this:
Exclusive:
- Egypt entry visa € 30, - per person (payable locally)
- Flight to Marsa Alam or Hurghada
- Local Fees € 220,- per person and tour for 7-day trips (payable locally)
- canned drinks and alcohol
- diving courses (on request, pre-booking required)
- equipment rental (on request, pre-booking required)
- € 40, - per week for 15 litre tanks
I'm sure that if you're paying 30 euros for the visa that costs 25$ at the bank kiosk or 40 euros per week for 15L air tanks, or 170 euros per full equipment per week they probably won't try anything else. I mean seriously, was talking about companies that try to do shenanigans after you haggle them down to realistic prices.
Just to make clear what I'm talking about: if you pay 40 euros per week for 15L they will probably give you 15L Nitrox without asking for extra money (really greedy ones will try to charge on top of that). However if you haggle them down to 5$ per diving day for 15L and forget to mention Nitrox, you bet it's going to be an air tank and you'll be asked for extra money onboard if you want 15L Nitrox.
JustSurfaceInterval
Contributor
This is all very speculative and a mistrustful generalised suspicion.
As per their website, Nitrox is included regardless of bottle size.
You don't have to pay them 30 EUR for the visa, you can get it yourself.
40 EUR per week for a 15 L is about 3-4 EUR per dive, nothing unusual... And 5 EUR per diving day is 25 - 30 EUR instead of 40. Yeah!
I can imagine, that if you start haggling for everything, they will be slighly pi... off and will do the same with you for services others are getting for free.
Anyway... you've got your view of the country and i've got mine. I wish you a better experience the next time you are there.
As per their website, Nitrox is included regardless of bottle size.
You don't have to pay them 30 EUR for the visa, you can get it yourself.
40 EUR per week for a 15 L is about 3-4 EUR per dive, nothing unusual... And 5 EUR per diving day is 25 - 30 EUR instead of 40. Yeah!
I can imagine, that if you start haggling for everything, they will be slighly pi... off and will do the same with you for services others are getting for free.
Anyway... you've got your view of the country and i've got mine. I wish you a better experience the next time you are there.
To give a further name: Subex, especially for german speaking customers.
This report sounda crazy to me.
< 50 dives but according to profile cmas and gue certified, but forgot his padi card(?). And given the restrictions you read you still wanted to go to Elphinstone without a check dive (I dont want to judge if you can handle it, but you do not fulfill the min requirements of dive operators...).
Well I dont believe people drive 130+ in egypt. Whenever I was on the minibus trip from airport to hotel or hotel to harbour it ws more like 80 to 100. And with the car and road condition that felt quick. I do not feel safe to go 130+ there.
And I can tell I am from Germany and have driven 240 to 250 km/h by car and 260 to 270 km/h by motorcycle. At least if its allowed, and road as well as traffic allows for it. But I do have racetrack experience, and my vehicle is in perfect and known condition to me. A csr in egypt is usually not in this condition. And sorry to say that egypt roads are conparable to Autobahn standard ... nonway.
Well yes there are bad roads in germany, no question. But I will not go 130+ there either.
This report sounda crazy to me.
< 50 dives but according to profile cmas and gue certified, but forgot his padi card(?). And given the restrictions you read you still wanted to go to Elphinstone without a check dive (I dont want to judge if you can handle it, but you do not fulfill the min requirements of dive operators...).
Well I dont believe people drive 130+ in egypt. Whenever I was on the minibus trip from airport to hotel or hotel to harbour it ws more like 80 to 100. And with the car and road condition that felt quick. I do not feel safe to go 130+ there.
And I can tell I am from Germany and have driven 240 to 250 km/h by car and 260 to 270 km/h by motorcycle. At least if its allowed, and road as well as traffic allows for it. But I do have racetrack experience, and my vehicle is in perfect and known condition to me. A csr in egypt is usually not in this condition. And sorry to say that egypt roads are conparable to Autobahn standard ... nonway.
Well yes there are bad roads in germany, no question. But I will not go 130+ there either.
Thanks, I've had mostly good experiences over the years and I wish you the same. If you read again my initial message about the matter you will see that I was rather pointing out what visitors should expect given the local culture, rather then complaining about anything but the most ridiculous attempt ever (the Millenium stunt, so to speak)
Yeah indeed. As I already mentioned, if you don't mind overpaying by a large margin (in this particular example 33 to 60%) I'm sure there are various operations out there that will provide a relatively hassle free experience. As a personal choice I'd rather immerse myself in the local culture of haggling and do 4 dive trips per year instead of 3 for the same money and the same condition.
Anyway, I was just pointing out that overpaying instead of haggling doesn't mean that you get a hassle free experience because this or that company is "good". In my book a company is good when you agree with them on certain fair terms and they deliver as agreed, without trying any tricks down the road.
A bedouin fellow that I'm using in Sharm area to go to Dahab, St Catherine, Cairo etc is doing about 130km/h. He's a fellow who certainly knows his limits, initially he was driving a beaten up Corolla and never went over 100, then he bought a relatively new Hyunday and is doing 130 in broad daylight on certain relatively good roads in the area. As a side note, when taking me to Cairo he would only enter as far as the airport, he clearly explained to me that he doesn't have "Cairo skills".
But we're talking about someone who drives those roads every day.
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What is the issue? ExtraDivers is a perfect example of transparancy, the cleary state what is not included at that is exactly what the charge you. If I don't need a visa, the the don't charge me for that (like every other operator I used in the last 20 years). The local fees vary depending on the trip and duration (and the fact that the Egyptian government is sometimes very creative). And there is no haggling. the reputables charge you what they advertise.
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