e-learning, is there enough time & what isnt being taught?

[almitywife]

so i was talking to a newbie diver the other week and he was telling me about his e-learning OW course and how fast it was

my OW course of old (10yrs ago) was one very full weekend in the pool/classroom with the following weekend doing ocean dives/paperwork

but

a dive shop i know has recently changed over to e-learning and ive now seen for myself that the pool skills and shop tour has been crammed into 2hrs on a friday night and then the students are shown the door with their hire gear and told see you at the ocean tomorrow

to be honest im a bit shocked because i do not believe that these people can get the pool training that they are entitled to in such little time - or am i wrong??

is this huge reduction in course hours normal for e-learning students?

 

[knotical]

Not normal.

e-learning only shortens the time the shop needs to spend on academics, not skills.

You’re right; there is no way the confined water portion of any reputable certification can be completed in 2 hours. Perhaps the skills are being introduced in so-called “confined open water” or open water with pool-like conditions. Perhaps it’s not really a certification, but a “try scuba” experience. Otherwise it’s a big red flag.

What certification card is issued, if any? What agency?

 

[kjvander]

I guess in a way this goes back to the instructor. I am working on my OW cert with a SDI instructor. All of the classes were online. You could work at your own pace and you had to pass all of the chapter quizzes and then the final. I just happened to get my access to mine on a day off....so I did it all in one day. I know with SDI the videos and the reading help and are pretty good...obviously nothing beats true hands on there in person training...but the way that the videos are put together are the next best thing.

When it came to the pool time we went through everything that is needed for the certification.....mask clearing reg retreval and the what not.

So I guess there are still some instructors out there that their main goal is to get students out the door with C-Cards and some that actually want to take the time with the students in the water but utilize the online training to expand the student base to those that can't make it to classes all the time (I'm an hour and a half from the shop).

Just my 2psi.

kyle

 

[PhilEllis]

The degree of mis-understanding about PADI eLearning and how it is executed is amazing. eLearning is simply another means of delivering the training materials to the student. It integrates an automated way to test a student for learning progression....instead of completing chapter "quizzies" in a book, they are completed during the course of the online learning. In addition, eLearning administers a final examination and logs the results of that testing.

When a customer comes to our first day of training in our store, they come in having either read the PADI Go Diving textbook and viewed the Go Diving DVD.....or they have taken eLearning. Regardless of the method of home study, all students participate in exactly the same amount of instructor lecture and classroom time. There is ONE difference....when it is time for the final exam, traditional study students take the complete PADI open water exam; eLearning students take a shorter 18 question exam. After all, they have already completed the final exam as a part of the completion of the eLearning program.

Aside from the METHOD OF DELIVERY of the student study material, and the abbreviated final written examination for eLearning students, there is no difference. PADI standards do not mandate any particular stated "hours" of classroom or pool time, so I guess if you had a complete class of eLearning students, the classroom time could be shortened a little. However, it could probably be shortened with traditional learning.

As I type, we have an instructor in the classroom with 9 new open water students. They are beginning the first of two days of classroom/pool learning. Six of them completed their home study using the traditional written student kit and 3 of them did home study using PADI eLearning. For us, all nine are the same thing....open water scuba students. They will all learn the same skills and they will all demonstrate that they understand the academic material. That is the requirement for certification.

Phil Ellis
Discount Scuba Gear at DiveSports.com - Buy Scuba Diving Equipment & Snorkeling Equipment

 

[Peter Guy]

Phil -- Do you require your OW students to totally complete the "book learning" process before Confined Dive #1 or just complete the process before Confined Dive #5 (or 6 if done)?

 

[PhilEllis]

Phil -- Do you require your OW students to totally complete the "book learning" process before Confined Dive #1 or just complete the process before Confined Dive #5 (or 6 if done)?

We ask them to completely read the book, view the DVD, and complete all knowledge reviews BEFORE they come for the first class. The instructor reviews all knowledge reviews for completion (not content) as a part of the pre-class equipment assignment and greeting process. Obviously, eLearning students present their course completion document at this point. They are then returned to the students for reference and correction during lectures. On Saturday morning, the instructor covers the first three chapters from the Go Dive student book. Pool begins at about 12:30 PM on Saturday afternoon and continues until about 6:30 PM. They typically complete confined water dives 1-3. On Sunday morning, they complete the remaining academic learning and take the examination. Just prior to returning to the pool, EACH student places their knowledge reviews in the permanent student file and hands them over to the instructor prior to leaving for the pool. Sunday afternoon is again pool from 12:30 PM until 6:30 PM (or sometimes a little later). We always have one or more staff Dive Masters helping with classroom and pool activities, regardless of the student count. We never permit more than 12 students per class.

If a student comes to class and HAS NOT done the pre-reading assignments and HAS NOT completed the knowledge reviews, we ask that they return to our next class. We consider student home study assignments to be mandatory and essential to our teaching method and schedule.

Phil Ellis

 

[Garrobo]

I took the SDI test over the internet a couple years ago. Cost $80 for the book, an hour or less to read it and 10 minutes to take the test. Having a good memory, I aced it. Saved a lot of time doing it this way. But........the LDS where I took my pool and OW had me sit in with the PADI students and do an oral test while they were taking the written test. I didn't think that the instructor had enough time to spend with each of us either in the pool or OW which has nothing to do with the e-testing. I hooked up with an instructor in Ft. Lauderdale and did several days of reef dives get the hang of it. Anyway, I've got over a hundred dives now and am still alive so I guess that the e-testing worked out OK. Like about any other physical undertaking or profession, the meat is in the doing. The brain stuff is secondary but that's how the providers make their money.