DIR- GUE Drysuit Primer Class Report

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acreichman

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36
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Location
Los Angeles, CA
# of dives
100 - 199
I haven't seen any course reports lately but they were super helpful when I was looking at classes, so I thought I'd add mine to the list. I just finished the GUE Drysuit Primer with Karim Hamza.

Some background:
I finished Fundies in February 2020 (about 8 months prior) with a rec pass and have done ~25 dives since then with other local GUE people. I eventually want to take the GUE Tech and CCR classes, so I needed a drysuit. I got my Seaskin suit (there's another thread on ScubaBoard that was incredibly helpful in customizing my suit) and started to look at training. I saw some people here who decided not to do a drysuit class and go out with a knowledgeable buddy instead but all my local scuba buddies talked about how different it is to dive dry and recommended the class. All the time I've spent with GUE instructors so far has been great so I decided to go for it. One of the nice things about diving in California is how many GUE instructors we have, including Karim, who does the drysuit repairs for the local community and can teach all the way up the tech chain. I managed to find a weekend that worked for both of us and packed up my gear.

Day 1:
I showed up at 8am, we chatted for a few minutes and got down to the academics. The materials for this class definitely seem like they might not have been updated as recently as some others but they effectively convey information about cold water diving. I'm assuming this is like most other classes where the classroom part can drag a little but Karim was really engaging. He had funny (and sometimes scary) stories that related to the material and made it interactive by peppering in questions and requests for feedback. I also appreciated that he had more questions beyond the ones from the presentation. I think he was making them up on the fly based on what he wanted to make sure I was understanding. Even if it had been boring, the theory section isn't supposed to be the highlight of a scuba class.

After lunch we got our gear and headed to the pool. I know it’s foolish but I didn’t expect to run into as many issues as I did. I’ll leave it to your imagination but if there was a mistake to be made, I probably made it. Fortunately, Karim was very patient and very thorough. He showed me step by step how to get into each layer of the suit, gave tips and tricks on how to be more efficient, and gave me some space to figure it out when things didn’t go as expected. In short, he was a great teacher. After getting the suit on and in the water, the first thing I realized is that squeeze hurts. I thought it would be uncomfortable like wearing clothes that are too tight but it’s much worse than that, especially in the feet. Squeeze hurts, venting the feet is hard and doing it while trying not to look like an idiot is almost impossible. With that said, Karim was very clear in his instructions, always had helpful tips and was incredibly patient. The thing I appreciated most was near the end of the pool session, when I’d been fighting the suit for what seemed like forever and was feeling pretty down about how it was going. I signaled to ascend, met him at the surface and just took a minute. I wasn’t able to articulate why I was struggling so much but eventually figured out the problem. He helped me deal with it on the surface, adjusted my gear to bring things more in line and when we went back down a few minutes later, I was able to complete the skill. On top of all that, he was constantly evaluating my non-drysuit skills. Karim pointed out ways I could improve my kicks, helped me refine my stability in the water, and gave me tips on how to more smoothly communicate with a team. None of those are directly related to my drysuit but they make the class much more helpful. The primer isn't just about learning a new piece of gear, it’s about how that gear fits into your overall diving, and that’s where I feel this class has been most helpful so far.

Day 2:
Getting to Catalina proved too difficult on short notice so we did our final day at Redondo Beach. While the dive park at Catalina would have been a lot easier to get in and out of, Redondo is where I do the majority of my diving so it was nice to get some experience there with an instructor. I don’t know if I realized it during Fundies, but ocean dives are really just a repeat of the pool work from the first day. The skills are the same and the instructor isn’t trying to trick you. Things were both easier and harder the second day. The ocean is a lot less predictable than a pool, there’s waves getting in, surge underneath, and visibility could always be better. The upside is that I was much more comfortable with the skills and was starting to get a feel for them. We did a bunch of ascents and descents and worked our way through all the skills from the day before. We also spent a lot of time going up and down a slope, adding and venting gas, which helped engrain the muscle memory (hopefully). The most difficult part of the class was consistently hitting the 3m stop. No matter how many times you’re told to anticipate the change and vent early, there’s nothing quite like experiencing it to really show the necessity of doing it. Having to tell your instructor afterwards that you didn’t do the things he told you to and experienced the mistake he said you would was unpleasant enough to make me swear not to do it again.

Final review:
To make this useful for other people looking at the drysuit primer, here are the answers to a few questions I was asking myself before taking it.

Do you really need to take a class in order to dive a drysuit?
I think so, for a few reasons. First, there are a lot of little things I got from Karim that I would have missed without taking the class. We spent a lot of time talking about argon bottles even though I don’t need one yet and how being cold affects on and off-gassing. I feel much more prepared for future cold water diving because of the class. Second, spending time in the pool was really valuable. I did a feet first ascent almost immediately and it was much more comfortable in a nice pool with good viz and no current instead of in the ocean. Having an easy environment to get comfortable with skills before needing to use them was helpful. Lastly, managing squeeze and another air bubble is hard to explain to somebody who hasn’t experienced it. Having an instructor (a good instructor) who has seen all the common mistakes and can explain and demonstrate the solutions in an efficient way is a valuable thing. If I was depending on a buddy in an informal (free) situation to teach me how to use a drysuit, I would either feel the need to pay them for their time and expertise (if it was done well) or have to do a lot of trial and error on my own to figure out situations that weren’t covered. In either case, I’d rather pay an instructor to do it quickly and efficiently. A drysuit is expensive enough that the class is a relatively small fraction of the cost and probably makes all of your dry dives better. Just like I wouldn’t buy a BC and try it out without getting professional training, a drysuit is just as, if not more, difficult and also requires training.

Do you need to take the GUE Drysuit Primer?
Probably not. I especially wouldn’t take the drysuit primer as my first GUE class, even though you can. If the rest of your gear is in the GUE configuration and you’re on board with the system, you’ve probably already taken another GUE class. If not, Fundies in a wetsuit is probably a better option. If you don’t have the GUE gear setup and aren’t interested in the rest of the system, some of the pieces of the drysuit primer just won’t be applicable. I don’t know how GUE instructors deal with non-GUE students taking a primer like this, but I think it’s more useful if you’ve already been exposed to the whole system. All the normal caveats about finding a good instructor you’re comfortable with still apply, but I wouldn’t recommend the drysuit primer as the first (or only) GUE class. If you are a GUE diver, at any level, I think it’s a really useful class.

What do you get out of the class?
As much as I’d like to say I’m now an expert drysuit diver, I’m not. I’ve had a chance to see somebody do it really well, ask all of my questions and I haven’t built any bad habits yet. If I didn’t think I was going to go diving pretty often and practice these skills, it would have been harder to justify the cost of the class. The fact that I do go diving often, with other GUE trained buddies, made it worthwhile for me. I’m really happy I took the class and I think it helped my diving and brought me closer to my goal of a Fundies tech pass than I would be without it.
 
Do you need to take the GUE Drysuit Primer?
Probably not. I especially wouldn’t take the drysuit primer as my first GUE class, even though you can. If the rest of your gear is in the GUE configuration and you’re on board with the system, you’ve probably already taken another GUE class. If not, Fundies in a wetsuit is probably a better option. If you don’t have the GUE gear setup and aren’t interested in the rest of the system, some of the pieces of the drysuit primer just won’t be applicable. I don’t know how GUE instructors deal with non-GUE students taking a primer like this, but I think it’s more useful if you’ve already been exposed to the whole system.
Thanks for the writeup, and sorry for digging up an old thread, but this seems like a timeless topic.

How would you adjust this advice if you lived in a cold climate where "Fundies in a wetsuit is probably a better option" is not reasonable advice?

Would you recommend they take the Drysuit specialty from whatever their current agency is and then take Fundies once they are proficient in their dry suit?

I'm a PADI vacation (warm water) diver and am thinking about giving GUE a shot and start diving at home. I'm in the process of purchasing a drysuit, and am already sold on the value of taking a drysuit class rather than just winging it. My current kit is not the GUE gear setup, but my plan was to upgrade the necessary bits to bring it into GUE spec either immediately before my first GUE class or rent for the class and upgrade after (based on the recommendation of my instructor).
 
...I'm in the process of purchasing a drysuit, and am already sold on the value of taking a drysuit class rather than just winging it. My current kit is not the GUE gear setup, but my plan was to upgrade the necessary bits to bring it into GUE spec either immediately before my first GUE class or rent for the class and upgrade after (based on the recommendation of my instructor).

It's funny that you mention the above because I just sat in on the online (classroom) portion of a GUE Fundies class today. The instructor was saying that it's best to talk with a GUE instructor before buying a drysuit, if it's not a DUI or Santi. This is because the dump valve can be in different spots, some (like Bare) more conducive to dumping diagonally, and the cut can be too tight at the shoulders, making it harder to reach the tank valve(s).

GUE uses the wing for primary buoyancy control and teaches to inflate the drysuit only enough to relieve the squeeze. Some other agencies teach the opposite, so a drysuit course from another agency will be less useful to you if you want to end up taking any GUE courses.

So it might be a good idea to chat with a GUE instructor and bounce your ideas off them. They're very receptive to interested divers.
 
. . .
Would you recommend they take the Drysuit specialty from whatever their current agency is and then take Fundies once they are proficient in their dry suit?

I would say no. It's my understanding that PADI, for example, teaches using the suit for primary buoyancy control--at least for single-tank diving--whereas GUE and other tech diving-oriented agencies teach using the wing for primary buoyancy control. Nevertheless, it's not like you would be the first to have to un-learn something. I was a PADI warm water vacation diver for 10 years before I took Fundies, and I'm sure I had plenty of habits to un-learn.

I'm a PADI vacation (warm water) diver and am thinking about giving GUE a shot and start diving at home. I'm in the process of purchasing a drysuit, and am already sold on the value of taking a drysuit class rather than just winging it. My current kit is not the GUE gear setup, but my plan was to upgrade the necessary bits to bring it into GUE spec either immediately before my first GUE class or rent for the class and upgrade after (based on the recommendation of my instructor).

As I said, I was a PADI warm water vacation diver before I took Fundies, but I had the luxury of taking Fundies in a wetsuit in the Florida springs. I bought the GUE-compatible gear just before the Fundies class, but I could have rented it. I'm glad I bought it, though. After Fundies, I enjoyed a year or so of continuing my warm water vacation diving in the GUE gear configuration and wetsuit. I was hooked on the GUE system--I felt it really made me a better, more relaxed, more in-control vacation diver. It was only then that I bought a drysuit and took Drysuit Primer (which also served as a great Fundies refresher). I am totally biased that if one is not in a hurry, this is a way for a vacation diver to take it one step at a time. If that sounds impractical, then maybe your only practical route is to take Fundies in a drysuit and learn it all together, keeping in mind you probably won't get as much out of Fundies as you might have if you had been more comfortable with the drysuit. You will not be the first person to do that, and I'm sure you will still get plenty out of it.
 
Hey. I guess I will revive this thread...

I already did my GUE-F 2 years ago (wetsuit Rec-pass), and after I moved to a more cold place and stayed mostly out of the water for a year, I scheduled my drysuit primer for late October.
In theory, last year I got some drysuit "training" from a LDS, as a way to support it, build connections, and maybe learn 1 thing or 2, which Ι "successfully passed" by being unable to hold a stop without fining like a maniac for 5 minute. In practice, the instruction was subpar to say the least, to the extend that I prefer to wait until my primer to get in my drysuit.

I am certain that the GUE-I will do a phenomenal job on every aspect (as they always tend to do), but I perform better if I have an idea on the processes, evaluation, etc. I would like to ask if there were any additional challenges OP or other people experienced that that were not expanded in this thread other than the early deflation during ascent issue.

Also, is there a written take-home exam and homework such as in GUE-F? Thankfully, during my GUE-F I knew beforehand that it will be an intense 5 days course with little rest so I focused for 5 days ONLY on the class. Is the drysuit-primer equally exhausting? I will be taking the class in my hometown during vacations and I am thinking whether it could be OK to go out with some friends in the evening/night.

P/S: Of course I will make sure to study all the material before the class.
 
...I would like to ask if there were any additional challenges OP or other people experienced that that were not expanded in this thread other than the early deflation during ascent issue.

Also, is there a written take-home exam and homework such as in GUE-F? Thankfully, during my GUE-F I knew beforehand that it will be an intense 5 days course with little rest so I focused for 5 days ONLY on the class. Is the drysuit-primer equally exhausting? I will be taking the class in my hometown during vacations and I am thinking whether it could be OK to go out with some friends in the evening/night.
For me, the drysuit primer was a very different experience from Fundies. It was 2 days instead of 4-5 so there wasn't nearly as much cumulative exhaustion. I also found it to be very specific, which was helpful. Fundies was a primer on everything, where this was a very detailed class on just one thing. Maybe that won't make as much of a difference for other people but when I finished Fundies, I felt like I'd been overloaded with information (sizing the backplate, the right way to attach bolt snaps, symptoms of narcosis vs. oxygen toxicity, and a million other things: all important but less of a priority than the in water skills). With the drysuit primer I was learning a single system and I felt like I had a decent grasp on the entirety of it.

As for your specific questions: I don't remember there being homework or an exam but it was 3 years ago so there could have been. I found the first (pool) day to be more exhausting than the ocean dives. Doing the academics and practicing all the skills for the first time was very tiring. The ocean dives were a repeat from the first day (no new material) and I was already used to doing multiple dives in a day so it was more manageable. I don't know that I would have wanted to go out with friends after either day but it doesn't sound as crazy as it would have during Fundies.

If you have other questions, feel free to DM me.
 
For me, the drysuit primer was a very different experience from Fundies. It was 2 days instead of 4-5 so there wasn't nearly as much cumulative exhaustion. I also found it to be very specific, which was helpful. Fundies was a primer on everything, where this was a very detailed class on just one thing. Maybe that won't make as much of a difference for other people but when I finished Fundies, I felt like I'd been overloaded with information (sizing the backplate, the right way to attach bolt snaps, symptoms of narcosis vs. oxygen toxicity, and a million other things: all important but less of a priority than the in water skills). With the drysuit primer I was learning a single system and I felt like I had a decent grasp on the entirety of it.

As for your specific questions: I don't remember there being homework or an exam but it was 3 years ago so there could have been. I found the first (pool) day to be more exhausting than the ocean dives. Doing the academics and practicing all the skills for the first time was very tiring. The ocean dives were a repeat from the first day (no new material) and I was already used to doing multiple dives in a day so it was more manageable. I don't know that I would have wanted to go out with friends after either day but it doesn't sound as crazy as it would have during Fundies.
Awesome! Thank you for appending your description. It gives me some of the insights I was looking for. Hopefuly it's of use for others that may check this thread.
If you have other questions, feel free to DM me.
Will certaintly do if I get any other general question. Thanks again.
 
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