DIR- Generic Drifting deco - when to shoot bag?

[steinbil]

What are your thoughts on shooting bags after let's say a wreck dive at technical depths with a drifting deco?

I often see posters here, especially from the UK wreck scene, discussing shooting bags at depth from a wreck in current, to immediately let boat captain know you're starting a drifting ascent. Is this a UK thing? Is it also common in the US?

I'm GUE trained and have been taught to only use spools for SMBs and to shoot the bag after the gas switch on a deco ascent, with the following reasoning:

• Don't waste time at depth

Being deep obviously racks up more deco, uses more gas resources, and it's a priority to get to the gas switch quickly after terminating the dive, to start off-gassing

• Spooling in a bag slows your ascent

Again, get to the gas switch quickly. It's hard to keep a proper ascent speed while spooling.

• A bag makes you drift more

An SMB adds drag and makes you drift further than a quick ascent without a bag. This is compounded by the previous point.

• Avoid complications at depth

This was not mentioned by my instructor, but is a consideration I have made myself. Shooting a bag takes time and has a non-zero risk. Keep it simple.

• It is unnecessary

You shouldn't take long to get to the gas switch, so you won't drift too far, and a good boat captain would know where to expect a bag. Once the gas switch is done and you will spend significant time drifting on deco, you of course need a bag for the captain to follow, but if they can't deal with waiting until the gas switch for a bag, get a better boat captain.

My questions:
- Do you agree with this reasoning?
- Other points to consider?
- Are there specific scenarios where you would deviate?
- Is this common? Is it hard to find boat captains that would agree to this protocol? I would hardly want to deviate from a boat captain's instructions.

 

[GF99/99]

I think this is very very dive site dependent and boat captain/crew dependent.

There is good arguments for both

 

[DiveLikeAMuppet]

Do exactly what the skipper told you to do.

You can put up a bag in 30 seconds, and reel in and ascend at 10 meters a minute no problem.

I’ve seen a cool-as-a-cookie GUE diver put up a black DSMB from 21 meters (after quite some struggle) on a 60 meter dive. The skipper rarely shouts but there was a bit of shouting that day

UK might also use a drifting deck station … with DSMBs only in an emergency (yellow for drop bottle, normal orange if lost).

 

[PfcAJ]

I’m a “shoot it from the bottom” guy.

 

[NothingClever]

Here in Florida, I’m a proponent for shooting early.

The Captain may have distractions (like recreational pick ups).

I prep two minutes out from ascent time/pressure on the lee side of the current (with the protection of the wreck) so that as soon as I come off the wreck I already have communication to the surface out of the way and can stay focused on the team, the ascent, stops and switches. A bag shot doesn’t take long.

I don’t think reeling in during the ascent takes appreciably more time such that your deco clock racks up.

The spool provides a clear reference point during blue water, drifting ascents.

 

[steinbil]

Do exactly what the skipper told you to do.

I agree, which is partly why I made this thread. If you don't agree with the captain's rules, suck it up or don't dive.

You can put up a bag in 30 seconds, and reel in and ascend at 10 meters a minute no problem.

Can you do that with a spool? I imagine a reel would be faster, but personally I think it might slow me down on a spool - at least at my current skill level.

I’ve seen a cool-as-a-cookie GUE diver put up a black DSMB from 21 meters (after quite some struggle) on a 60 meter dive. The skipper rarely shouts but there was a bit of shouting that day

Haha, this sounds like a joke. Are black SMBs even made?

 

[wetb4igetinthewater]

Are black SMBs even made?

I have seen ones that were black on one side. These are the best DSMB color when the diver is between the boat and a very low sun due to the contrast. That's the theory at least.

 

[rjack321]

The captain is part of your team, and sometimes the only person who's done that particular wreck or one similar to it. Sometimes they need training, sometimes they train you.

In the highest current areas we come up the grapple buoy line to our 1st switch/stop depth using scooters as needed. We then stow the scooters, switch as needed, shoot the bag, and drift.

Part of why we do it this way around here is we absolutely need that hook on the wreck to be able to find it on descent. If that buoy is hooked into the wreck, we don't want to be shooting a bag from the bottom that then may get tangled in the grapple line. So we come up that line first and shoot the SMB once we're free of it. We don't just come up randomly from the wreck either since again, we could tangle in the grapple line that we can't see cause its 150-200m long and at a massive angle in the current.

The boat comes back later to grab the grapple buoy. Other areas with their own environments have different drivers.

 

[lairdb]

Haha, this sounds like a joke. Are black SMBs even made?

36" Inch SMB w/ Reflective Tape Edges!.."Closed Bottom Type" "All BLACK Smb!"

When surface visibility is important, such as performing stops during deco or surfacing after a drift dive The New Piranha Dive all black Smb gives you or your dive boat a very different way to spot a diver on the surface! We also highly recommend a whistle to grab the dive boat's attention or...

www.piranhadivemfg.com

6ft / 72" inch Yellow/Black SMB "Flapper / Duck Valve bottom"

6 Feet Length 6" X 72" 210 Denier with a urethane backing Approximately 40+lbs of lifting capacity Small compact design for easy storage with bungee to hold it rolled up or use the valcron strapped that holds it rolled up! Our smb has a oral / Bc hose inflator at the bottom or use a Bc hose to...

www.piranhadivemfg.com

6ft / 72" inch Red One Side/Black Other Side SMB "Flapper / Duck Valve bottom" 5 left!

6 Feet Length 6" X 72" 210 Denier with a urethane backing Approximately 40+lbs of lifting capacity Small compact design for easy storage with bungee to hold it rolled up or use the valcron strapped that holds it rolled up! Our smb has a oral / Bc hose inflator at the bottom or use a Bc hose to...

www.piranhadivemfg.com

6ft / 72" inch Bright Pink One Side/Black Other Side SMB "Flapper / Duck Valve bottom"

6 Feet Length 6" X 72" 210 Denier with a urethane backing Approximately 40+lbs of lifting capacity Small compact design for easy storage with bungee to hold it rolled up or use the valcron strapped that holds it rolled up! Our smb has a oral / Bc hose inflator at the bottom or use a Bc hose to...

www.piranhadivemfg.com

 

[rjack321]

36" Inch SMB w/ Reflective Tape Edges!.."Closed Bottom Type" "All BLACK Smb!"

When surface visibility is important, such as performing stops during deco or surfacing after a drift dive The New Piranha Dive all black Smb gives you or your dive boat a very different way to spot a diver on the surface! We also highly recommend a whistle to grab the dive boat's attention or...

www.piranhadivemfg.com

6ft / 72" inch Yellow/Black SMB "Flapper / Duck Valve bottom"

6 Feet Length 6" X 72" 210 Denier with a urethane backing Approximately 40+lbs of lifting capacity Small compact design for easy storage with bungee to hold it rolled up or use the valcron strapped that holds it rolled up! Our smb has a oral / Bc hose inflator at the bottom or use a Bc hose to...

www.piranhadivemfg.com

6ft / 72" inch Red One Side/Black Other Side SMB "Flapper / Duck Valve bottom" 5 left!

6 Feet Length 6" X 72" 210 Denier with a urethane backing Approximately 40+lbs of lifting capacity Small compact design for easy storage with bungee to hold it rolled up or use the valcron strapped that holds it rolled up! Our smb has a oral / Bc hose inflator at the bottom or use a Bc hose to...

www.piranhadivemfg.com

6ft / 72" inch Bright Pink One Side/Black Other Side SMB "Flapper / Duck Valve bottom"

6 Feet Length 6" X 72" 210 Denier with a urethane backing Approximately 40+lbs of lifting capacity Small compact design for easy storage with bungee to hold it rolled up or use the valcron strapped that holds it rolled up! Our smb has a oral / Bc hose inflator at the bottom or use a Bc hose to...

www.piranhadivemfg.com

The scuba industry has got to be one of the dumbest universes ever.

Number of survival suits made in high visibility black? 0
Number of PFDs made in high visibility black? 0
Number of survival rafts made in high visibility black? 0
Number of reflective vests for highway workers made in high visibility black? 0
Number of rescue helicopters made in high visibility black? 0
Number of coast guard rescue RIBs made in high visibility black? 0
ANY rescue or OSHA approved high vis product made in "high visibility" black? 0

Scuba SMBs in black? YUS!!! More cooler!!!