Double Check Your Gear

[belairbrian]

Amen.

And do you want to create a dependency on a new gear feature?

BTW, I wonder if BelairBrian might be involved in the sale of this particular product

Might want to change your screen name.

No I have no connection to XS Scuba or any entity selling anything.

I mentioned this only because I felt it relevant to the discussion. I did not seek these valves out they were installed on tanks I bought.

Lets see:
Why switch to an SPG a J valve will let you know you're low on Air
BCD what for All those valves buckles and parts to break.
Integrated weights what for lead blocks on a web belt are simpler.

 

[Jim Lapenta]

Jim, you are a conscientious Instructor and I appreciate your posts on SB. But I doubt that new divers will tell a boat crew to not touch their gear.

New divers are intimidated by boat crews. People have had it beaten into their heads that they should follow the instructions of the crew.

And that is the fault of the instructor. When we go over the "who is responsible" paper I wrote, in my class I make it very clear if they ever see me do something that is out of their comfort level or training to call me on it and refuse to do it. On OW checkouts today there is a large cabin cruiser sunk in the quarry. It is big enough to hold 3 or 4 divers. But there is only one way in and out, the windows are too small to swim out of. On dive two I purposely went in while they were all gathered on the stern. Depth is maybe 12 feet there. I waved one pair to join me. They moved forward slightly, looked at the cabin, looked at the ceiling, and refused to enter. I signaled "why?". They pointed at the overhead and gave me a no way. They passed.:cool2: I teach that DM's ,Guides, and Instructors (including me) should not be trusted blindly. Especially when it comes to new situations. I would not have been surprised to have gotten a one finger salute today when I asked them to come in. The husband admitted that it did cross his mind!

Additionally, new divers have been taught to follow the instructions of Instructors and Divemasters, who are held up as authority figures. Heck they're called Captains and Divemasters.

Again why and by who? Not me. If they are then it is the instructors themselves who are putting people in danger.

That true. It's SOP on some boats to check air.

Again I don't care if it is. I will stop, turn around, and take off my gear to check it if someone other than me touches my gear as I'm ready to step off, unless it's to hand me my fins from the bucket if they use one. I don't care if it does make them mad. I tell my students to make it clear on any boat that they will set up and check their gear and once done no one else touches it.

I like that.

I teach my students to avoid chatting when they are assembling their gear. That's how distraction mistakes can occur.

And, you're right, Jim, about your suggestion that we need to produce better trained divers.

Try telling that to those who put $ signs ahead of comprehensive training. Instructors only do less because they're allowed and even encouraged to in order to force divers back for training they should have already received.

 

[aquaregia]

Integrated weights what for lead blocks on a web belt are simpler.

I actually don't know why people use integrated weights, it just seems to make the tank weigh even more when you lift it for donning.

 

[bowlofpetunias]

Everyone is talking about checking before you splash but I was taught that the second check is just as vital. When you get to the bottom or the start point of your dive ... check all your equipment is performing and check your gauges before you continue the dive.

I have caught over zealous boat staff checking my valve as I was putting on fins to stride in. Perhaps the coloured indicators on the valves would help them keep their hands off? You can tell them, you can demonstrate your competence handling your own gear but some of them just can't seem to help themselves

aquaregia.. the integrated weights should be put in after donning your gear!

 

[victor]

Everyone is talking about checking before you splash but I was taught that the second check is just as vital. When you get to the bottom or the start point of your dive ... check all your equipment is performing and check your gauges before you continue the dive.

I agree, after my descent I check tank preasure, buoyancy, trim, etc and make any adjustments, sets me up for the rest of the dive.

I have caught over zealous boat staff checking my valve as I was putting on fins to stride in. Perhaps the coloured indicators on the valves would help them keep their hands off? You can tell them, you can demonstrate your competence handling your own gear but some of them just can't seem to help themselves

Many boat staff are conditioned to check valves as they assist you in putting on your gear. This seems to be particularly common on small boats and resorts where they 'normally' set up the divers gear for them.

aquaregia.. the integrated weights should be put in after donning your gear!

If you are diving with an insta buddy remember to explain how to release your particular style or weights in an emergency. Read the accidents forum to see how many divers make it to the surface then sink and are recovered with their weights still on.

 

[String]

True dat. It's also another reason why being comfortable with removal & replacement of the scuba unit underwater is a good idea.

Really?! So when you have no breath the answer is to take 20 seconds extra to remove gear and check a valve!? If someone has no air they aren't going to want to take off their gear mid water and fix that.

Why not do the far saner method and dive with the tank set so you can reach the valve by reaching back? Then get into the habit of making sure its open on the descent part of every dive?

As for backing off from the stop of a valve i had an older valve on one of my tanks that would jam into an open position after and during diving if it was on all the way. The "slightly back" ensures the valve isnt jammed and can easily be manipulated underwater.

 

[String]

Why switch to an SPG a J valve will let you know you're low on Air

Because it doesnt tell you *how much* air. "low on air" is subjective. 50 bar at 30m id class as low. 50 bar at 6m i wouldnt.

BCD what for All those valves buckles and parts to break.

So get a 1 piece harness.

Integrated weights what for lead blocks on a web belt are simpler.

As well as simpler they're more comfortable and a lot more secure!

 

[bowlofpetunias]

Many boat staff are conditioned to check valves as they assist you in putting on your gear. This seems to be particularly common on small boats and resorts where they 'normally' set up the divers gear for them.

I always make it clear that I will set up my own gear other than weight pockets which I explain below. There is nothing like doing it yourself to know it is right and that I will be able to break it down myself because things haven't been cranked on too tight:blinking:

If you are diving with an insta buddy remember to explain how to release your particular style or weights in an emergency. Read the accidents forum to see how many divers make it to the surface then sink and are recovered with their weights still on.

that is why I ask my buddy to put my weight pockets in for me after I gear up. I know they know how they work because I have got them to "work them" I will admit tho that I seldom have insta buddies, I normally have the luxury of bringing my own or arranging in advance who I will dive with.

BTW I am with you on the too old for very cold water dives. What are the water temps in your home area normally?

 

[Maladryne]

Really?! So when you have no breath the answer is to take 20 seconds extra to remove gear and check a valve!? If someone has no air they aren't going to want to take off their gear mid water and fix that.

Why not do the far saner method and dive with the tank set so you can reach the valve by reaching back? Then get into the habit of making sure its open on the descent part of every dive?

Out of air? Probably not. The scenario in question, as I understand it, is that the tank valve isn't all the way on, so breathing is restricted. Certainly, there are a number of ways to solve that particular problem. Diving with a tank set so you can reach the valve is a given; but then, so is checking to make sure that your valve is on before you get in the water.
My comment was more to the point of being comfortable with your gear and the concept of self-rescue; I'm not sure that there was an implied "this is the way you should do it" in there.

 

[openmindOW]

When we go over the "who is responsible" paper I wrote, in my class I make it very clear if they ever see me do something that is out of their comfort level or training to call me on it and refuse to do it.

That's terrific. I haven't done that, but you have given me something to think about doing.

I teach that DM's ,Guides, and Instructors (including me) should not be trusted blindly.

As I said, you're a conscientious Instructor.

Try telling that to those who put $ signs ahead of comprehensive training. Instructors only do less because they're allowed and even encouraged to in order to force divers back for training they should have already received.

I agree.