Do NOT Touch! Just Venting

[Mako Mark]

there is still no excuse simbrooks, I believe that removing peoples life support equipment is tantamount to murder..

 

[The Kraken]

The actions referred to are criminal in nature and in action.
The death of a person caused while in the act of a criminal offense can be prosecuted as manslaughter in most cases and in some states, given the right circumstances, 2nd degree murder.

 

[simbrooks]

there is still no excuse simbrooks, I believe that removing peoples life support equipment is tantamount to murder..

I wasnt excusing it in any way, just stating that you try to expect the unexpected when you can. Yes you get very PO'd about things going missing, but that isnt much help when you have to find your way out or complete deco without your deco gas. Dont read the post as saying that i even remotely commend or endorse these types of actions, all i am saying is that training does include methods or approaches to overcome this should it happen - it just seems to be happening more and more these days.

I dont know who the offenders are, are they cavers (you would seriously hope not), are they OW divers poking around in the cavern zone or are they the college kids/rednecks coming and tubing down the river and finding some pretty thing to take home and put on their mantle? What solutions do we have to get around this? Should we really have to put up signs or ask commercial entities running some of these sites (or the state parks) to include in their intro videos some kind of warning of the dangers to the cavers about this - as people just dont seem to have common sense?

 

[cdiver2]

I have heard (and seen the after effects - anger only, no injury thankfully) of stuff being taken from the open areas, picnic benches, and floating in the OW area whilst other gear is ferried down to the entrance. I havent heard of stuff being taken that was "well" hidden in the cave system or reels being wound up that are attached to the main line, that is bad news. There was that talk on "snap n gap" lines being part of the cause of Cenote deaths recently, that sounds like a dangerous line management issue and is something else altogether. However a good working knowledge of the layout of the cave system, plenty of backgas and proceedures for finding cut lines (such as that leading to the entrance of cut main line) as well as deco on backgas in case of lost deco gas are all things learnt through cave training courses, so at least people have a fighting chance should these idiots do such things.

What I was alluding to is, I sincerely hope it is not divers or worse still fellow cave divers as has been said this is the lowest of the lowest. Equipment left on a picnic bench....well thats accessible to everyone even the lowest life forms.

 

[The Kraken]

Simon,
You've given the three most likely probable culprits.

Albeit there are some very sick people in the world, I would have the tendency to rule out the possible culprits as divers as you give in your first two examples, I just find that possibility beyond the pale of conscience.

I do strongly believe that the culprits are those that fall in you third description.

Give our current "throw away" culture, I would venture to guess that this has happened as described. Some kids, coming down a river on tubes, see some tanks floating about in the water. Not seeing anyone around to whom the tanks could belong, they assume that the tanks are abandoned and simply take them as trophies of the outting.

This is when it's good to have a non-diving partner.

 

[simbrooks]

I do strongly believe that the culprits are those that fall in you third description.

Give our current "throw away" culture, I would venture to guess that this has happened as described. Some kids, coming down a river on tubes, see some tanks floating about in the water. Not seeing anyone around to whom the tanks could belong, they assume that the tanks are abandoned and simply take them as trophies of the outting.

This is when it's good to have a non-diving partner.

A spotter would be good. IF i leave my gear out i try to make sure someone is around to watch it whilst i hit the shower/bathroom or grab some lunch - i do the same for them in return to prevent the gear being unattended and a potential target. The only case i cant quite get is how reels get taken, i dont think many freedivers could take the time to go in and get them, whereas OW divers might have time, again they would be dumb divers. The only other guess i have off of this about reels is that cavers mistake it for their own, or as in the recent case, they were sharing a reel and the cookie got taken, but they went the wrong way, the second team comes along and thinks the first is on their way out so takes the reel - we all know the solution to that one

 

[MikeFerrara]

Only if I could introduce them to the business end of a Glock.

And what do you have against S&W, Ruger or Colt?

Bill Ruger was one of the most progressive gun designers of recent times and Glocks are for strokes

 

[chickdiver]

And what do you have against S&W, Ruger or Colt?

Bill Ruger was one of the most progressive gun designers of recent times and Glocks are for strokes

Just happens to be what I own....


FWIW- a great deterrent to this type of activity is stenciling your name in nice, big 3" letters on every tank you own. In fact- nearly every every bit of gear I own has "CHOAT" prominently and permanently marked on it.

 

[redacted]

I'm just an OW diver with no desire to try caves, but it seems to me this is not opportunistic tubers if the thefts are endangering lives other than those of the theives. They shouldn't be able to get to reels, lines, and staged (full) bottles. So the culprit is probably divers or some well equipped and conspicuous tubers.

Perhaps it is time for some camera surveilence at popular sites so comings, goings and associated equipment can be reviewed in an investigation. It may be another expense for the site manager, but if they are profiting from access fees, they should have some responsibility for the safety of the site.

 

[simbrooks]

The only case i cant quite get is how reels get taken, i dont think many freedivers could take the time to go in and get them, whereas OW divers might have time, again they would be dumb divers. The only other guess i have off of this about reels is that cavers mistake it for their own, or as in the recent case, they were sharing a reel and the cookie got taken, but they went the wrong way, the second team comes along and thinks the first is on their way out so takes the reel - we all know the solution to that one

Just checked on TDS and there is that thread on a stolen gap reel, so i guess it does happen and looking at the dates i would say that GDI seeing and responding to that thread also prompted him to start this one here.