RockPile
Contributor
wedivebc:
The defendents, a divemaster among them, in the Tancredi case (which I posted previously) paid out almost a half-million. That sounds successful to me.
JB
DMs can get in trouble?
- Thread starter all4scuba05
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The defendents, a divemaster among them, in the Tancredi case (which I posted previously) paid out almost a half-million. That sounds successful to me.
JB
Where did you get that information? I have not found info on any judgement in that case.RockPile:
RockPile
Contributor
all4scuba05:
Absolutely nothing. No harm, no foul. That was a good day in the water.
pusser:
The divemaster certification is not a battlefield promotion. Divemasters have worked hard for their level of certification. They have conscientiously put themselves into a documented position of authority and responsibility. That's part of the attraction; to be so good you know you are best suited to lead. And anytime you do that, no matter what the profession or activity, your actions carry more liability.
On the other hand Pusser, as you stated above, divemasters aren't a very big target because there's not much to be gained in terms of damages (with the exception of the rare millionaire DM). But the possibility remains (lightning). I think that's a good reason to be careful, as are most of the divemasters I've met.
I and a few others are looking into this matter, not to educate possible litigants on the topic, but to educate divers and divemasters and those considering making the transition between the two (and, frankly, just for myself).
The way this is working out, it seems like there are two good ways for a divemaster to stay out of trouble. The first is to be good at the job and to stay conditioned to give quality responses to different emergencies. The second is to operate, when possible (and there are places this doesn't work), under a policy that utilizes a good waiver of liability and anything else to document the divers assumption of risk. I think Bruce is going to be able to advance that issue a little more.
JB
ramblinpaul
Contributor
all4scuba05:
"Does the DM HAVE to get in the water?" If their title is "DM" than I would expect them to be in the water "mastering the dive".
On my 5th dive after my O/W certification (9th dive), while I was diving with the same Roatan resort where I'd just been certified a few days earlier. It was the last dive of the vacation and my "class buddy" decided not to dive.
I told the DM on the boat that I had no buddy, and his response was "Well, I'm not diving, so just stay with the rest of the group......" He knew my level of experience and yeah, I really expected him to be in the water......
When I was diving in Playa del Carmen and Cozumel, the DM from my first day of diving with the dive shop was great, and joined us for a day of diving on his day off.
Guess, which dive operation I speak higher of........
ItsBruce
Contributor
all4scuba05:
The bit about "choose the dive location according to their abilities and conditions" is the kicker. It is easy to allege the DM chose a dive location above someone's ability. It is equally easy to find an expert to opine the location was above the diver's ability.
Sorry to be the bearer of bad news.
ItsBruce
Contributor
wedivebc:
See Tancredi v. Dive Makai Charters, 823 F.Supp. 778 (D.Ha 1993)
ItsBruce
Contributor
I'm about to start a new thread based in part on this discussion and my analysis of the Tancredi case that has been mentioned above. I think it warrants a new thread because it will contain a warning for everyone. (I haven't figured out the name for the thread yet, but look around for it.)
In the litigeous world we live in you've got to be aware that if someone trips over there own toe, the courts can deem that it was someone else's fault. Regardless if the DM is in the water or not, if something goes wrong, there is always the possibility of someone sueing. And depending on how persistent they are (and how much they pay) it will usually end with a head in a noose. Crap obeys the law of gravity and slides downhill, and the bottom of the hill is where the DM's are found. A DM needs to be attentive and alert. If they believe a diver is a liability to themselves and others, it would be best for them to be in the water where they can monitor air, depth and panic and always prepare for the wrong thing. There is always the possibility of it being you at the end of a noose, and from my experience I have seen some strange and disturbing dive practices. I have been vigilant in discouraging them, but at the end of the day, I'd rather be judged by 12 than carried by 6.
OP
all4scuba05
Contributor
From what I understand, its impossible and dangerous to buddy up with 6 divers. You can't possible make yourself accesible to all 6 divers. So if a DM has to protect his _ss from liability by being a buddy to the "most likely to cause a problem" diver, the DM is doomed. Why on earth should it be the DM's responsibility for every diver in his group?
tracker
Guest
Good thread. Thanks for the learning experience
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