dive master or master diver ?

[marco58]

hey all. I just got my drysuit cert. and with my deep diver cert. and AOW, now I am wondering if I should go for dive master or master diver. I know that I do not have to teach with the dive master cert. but which is better for someone who likes to dive but is not that in) terested in going overseas or to the ocean. Do I need all the certs. with a dive master? If not, then how would a person teach wreck diving without the cert? Just wondering. By the way, diving with the dry suit was a blast!! Loved the fact that getting out inbetween dives I was not shivering. Still need a few more dives ( my instructor says about 25) to get used to using the inflators instead of the BCD for buoyancy, but that is what diving is all about. Getting better and more comfortable with the water.

 

[iluvcozumel]

Depends on your certifying agency. Padi Master Diver really is not that prestigious, NAUI requires more knowledge and actually is the first step towards Dive Master. So, if you are PADI, go for the Dive Master. But either way, I'm not sure you will be able to teach wreck diving with the Dive Master certification. I'm sure someone will chime in here and fill us in.

 

[tstormdiver]

There is a difference between Master Diver & Dive Master. Master diver is a non professional level. For most agencies it requires a minimum or 4 specialties, a rescue course & a minimum of 50 logged dives. It is more of a recognition level. Dive Master is a professional level. It usually encompasses working the dive industry by leading divers on dives &/or possibly assisting with classes. Though some remain at the Dive Master level, many use it as a path towards instructor level. The prerequisites between agencies vary some, but most require at a minimum a rescue course & 75 or so logged dives. With most agencies, to be able to teach wreck (or any potentially overhead environments) you must be at least an instructor &, depending on the agency, must co-teach, go through a seminar or possibly even extensive training to teach it.

By the way, you should only inflate your BC enough to loft the undergarments to satve off squeeze & keep you warm. Use the BC for its intended purpose (buoyancy control).

 

[Jim Lapenta]

Actually I 'd recommend you do neither one. 0-24 dives with AOW, drysuit, and deep. Time to stop taking classes and get another 50 or so dives in and work on what you just learned. Perfect your buoyancy and trim as much as possible. Do you have all your own gear at this time? If not work on getting that. I would not take on a DM student that did not have their own gear excluding tanks.

Also why would you use the suit for buoyancy? That's not the way it is done in the real world for the most part. Just enough air in the suit to take off the squeeze and use the bc for buoyancy control. I know what the agencies say but that is based largely on the assumption that new divers are too dumb to manage 3 forms of buoyancy control at the same time and fact is that is false. You can use the BC, suit, and breathing to fine tune your buoyancy and in fact should. If there is any one class you should do next it;s rescue. Everything else can wait. And in fact should. And work on getting your nav skills down. That is a core skill of any competent diver IMO.

Get with some experienced divers and just watch what they do. Listen to them. Often how it works in the real world is not what you learned in class. How much gas planning did you do in your classes? Work on that as well. As for Dm or Master Diver it depends on what master diver you are talking about. If it's just doing more courses and paying for a card I'd stay away from that.

NAUI and SEI have actual master diver courses where you will learn instructor level knowledge without the teaching component. You'll be required to work on and exhibit freediving skills, get experience in various environments under various conditions. You'll cover hyperbaric medicine and decompression procedures. How much of that was covered in your deep course? If it wasn't I'd look into that.

As for Dive Master you should have close to demo quality skills when you begin. They will get refined in the course. You should want to teach and enjoy working with new divers. I'd also recommend a tech class or two if you think you'd like to teach wreck. You cannot officially teach any kind of wreck class without going up through DM, AI, and Instructor. Heck I'd recommend a tech class of at least intro to anyone considering going the pro route so that you get some idea of it before starting a DM course. As a pro I feel you should have some level of knowledge above that of recreational divers. It will also introduce you to new gear configurations and techniques that will help you in all areas.

 

[spectrum]

I'm with Jim, Slow down and go dive.

Master diver is pretty much the highest summary cert in the non-pro ladder. I believe NAUI is the only one where it involves unique course content. the others (PADi, SSI...???) just mean rescue, some specialties and maybe a nominal number of dives.

DM is the bottom of the Pro ladder.

With regard to certification to instruct. When getting past the basics the ability to instruct is course specific. If an instructor has not trained and tested to instruct wreck diving to use your example they simply do not have that course in their repertoire.

Pete

 

[Jim Lapenta]

SEI Master Diver is similar to NAUI and in the US we can also issue a CMAS 4 star diver card for Master Diver plus DRAM and 100 dives.

 

[tstormdiver]

Very eloquently put, Jim.

 

[Tigerman]

I agree on the slow down the classes and go dive instead.
However, I dont completely agree with Jim about bouyancy while diving a drysuit.
There is two different ways of managing bouyancy while diving dry and neither one is more "wrong" or "correct" than the other.

"Jims way" of using the BC for bouyancy and just remove the squeeze from the drysuit. If you have a heavy gear setup, this could become the most practical.

"My way" of using the drysuit for bouyancy. If you dive with "average rec gear" this negates the need of using the BC, thus only 1 compartement with air. If youre properly weighed "Jims way" turn into this way because removing the squeeze give you just about neutral bouyancy anyways. Granted, as mentioned above, that you dont have a particularily heavy gear setup.

Some reommend one way, others the other way. The booklet that came with my drysuit recommended both - as in saying its much down to personal preference.

 

[TSandM]

I guess, in order to answer your question about classes, I'd have to know what it is you see in your diving that you would like to improve or change.

It's already been explained that, in the PADI system, Master Scuba Diver is a recognition award, given because you have completed a set number of classes. It has no set curriculum or evaluation, and introduces nothing new. Divemaster is a certification to prepare you for operating on a professional basis with students or guiding clients. Although you review a fair amount of classroom material, the course introduces no new diving skills and often doesn't really even evaluate your ability to use the ones you have. It WILL, if well taught and if you do a fair amount of interning, improve both your ability to do "demonstration quality" skills (often done while negative and not really"diving") and your situational awareness (students can, and will do almost anything you can imagine).

Beyond a certain point, classes really become about what YOU want to learn, improve or change. If you can articulate those things, the answer to what (if any) further classes you should take may become obvious.

 

[aquaregia]

Beyond a certain point, classes really become about what YOU want to learn, improve or change. If you can articulate those things, the answer to what (if any) further classes you should take may become obvious.

It's funny, I was just thinking about this today. I'm considering taking some classes that, from a certification point of view, don't make a whole lot of sense but that I think would be a good experience in general.