Did the DM go too far?

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Diver0001:
A DM is entitled to run his group any way he/she sees fit.

R..

What?! Not when I'm on board! I suppose they are entitled to anything needed to run the dive properly. I respect the DM designation, but I won't be giving them carte blanche with my safety, ever. There are some very talented, bright DMs, and there are some fools too.


The Kraken:
However, I don't think a D/M should ever force a diver to breathe down a tank to that extent. Just asking for trouble.

I agree. This was a case of a DM mismanaging gas. That's not what the octo is for, and that gas should have been earmarked for emergencies.

JB
 
Walter:
I agree with rockjock. If I'm there to take pictures, I'm going to take pictures.

I agree with Walter and company. If I go on a trip to take pictures, I am going to take pictures. I do not have ANY experience, however, with commercial operations and divemasters,in the way they are used in Coz, I have always dived from private boats. The few times I have been on commercial charters the DM was the person who tied into the wreck, handed me my camera after I splashed and lugged gear.
 
In response to Floater's question...
Well, yes and no.
He did, indeed, stop hoovering because he refused to dive again with that service. He found another diving location and activity. Personally, I don't think he ever was "hoovering". I felt he was entirely within the constraints of the normal variations of divers and bottom times for the profile we were diving.
 
I think this DM was doing their job. While I might not agree with having the hoover breathe off the DM's octo, rather than both you and he ascend and wait at the surface after your SS, I think that was a judgement call. I think this DM went the extra mile for the hoover and did not shorten your dive either.

The instructor telling the hoover not to take his camera on the second dive because it might have contributed to their excessive air consumption I also view as the DM doing his job, and doing it well. This DM gets high marks in my book. The DM was very safety conscious and did not want to shorten the groups bottom time.
 
RockPile:
What?! Not when I'm on board!

When i'm running a dive there is only one DIVE master and it's me. If you're in a position to run your own dive then I'll give you the room to do so but if you're not then either you run your dive within the boundaries I set or you get off the boat.

R..
 
rockjock3:
He stated his buddy wasn't normally a hoover, but I have a question. How the heck does it screw up your diving if I have to surface early with my buddy because of air consumption?

It doesn't effect you in the slightest. I have never been on a boat where they end the dive for everybody just because one group goes up. I have really low air consumption as does my buddy and when we get back on the boat many of the divers, if not all, are already back on it and some of them have even had the time to dekit and change tanks. They didn't screw up my dive at all.

If anything the DM screwed up the dive for everybody else outside the one buddy pair by forcing the diver to share air and therefore limiting the DMs ability to move around as freely and point things out to the divers that were diving with him.


Oh yes, it does. There are places where very swift currents converge on walls and then you get taken over a ledge, etc. There are places where you CAN surface but...you don't want too. I am not sure I would understand this pre-Pelelui. And it is easy to say the person does not belong there, BUT what if you have a leak in your BC, which happened to me on Blue Corner? I had no idea why my air was so low...Or why, JB, a triathelete who was sucking air for no obvious reason...relaxed, no sculling. Turns out his resting HR was 100---whole nother story. People that think they have all the answers and just say " well, just do this or that..." should dive more places in more remote worlds, and you will learn to value skills not listed by PADI. Look, some places the boat captains chew beetle nut and snooze. It doesn't matter if you think it is "correct" or not. if you are going to dive there then what is important is that you notice what the deal is, what the DANGERS are, and improvise accordingly. Just my opinion, of course. The really rigid people put themselves in danger, in my view, cause when they can't dive outside the box, they are lost and get caught with their pants down, so to speak.

and another thing, Rob, that is probably fine, if the DM is you. I have found traveling (and Here) that there are Divemasters you are better off ignoring sometimes and it is not always in your best interest to make a big deal out of it. Sometimes they may have zip education, or a hangover, or worse. You can't always just stomp off and find another operator. Sometimes, you need to think for yourself and just ignore them on some things. I wish I had ignored the last (very knowledgable) Divemaster who told me not to take my reefhook, the current was too swift, and then changed his mind, and parked me by placing my hands on the wall because some epic shark action was taking place. It took a couple months for my hands to heal. Nope...you don't want to do something, just ignore them. A dive master is there to be your "guide" a facilitator...not your nanny. They are not even responsible for your profile, so how come some of you are putting them in charge of EVERYTHING? They have no authority. And if you are diving like it is their job to save your life, you are miscalculating.
 
Diver0001:
When i'm running a dive there is only one DIVE master and it's me. If you're in a position to run your own dive then I'll give you the room to do so but if you're not then either you run your dive within the boundaries I set or you get off the boat.

R..

Deal. If the boundaries you set are dangerous and stupid, I will get off your boat. Air mismanagement is not something a DM (or you for that matter) is "entitled" too.

If you think you are entitled to do whatever you want, your designation has gone to your head. I think you should relax the caps lock in your writing. I'm not advocating that the cattle band together and overthrow the DM during a dive. I'm advocating that divers be smart and independent minded enough to recognize unsafe practices. And I can't think of a single reason that would seem unsettling to a well-trained, safe DM.

JB
 
Diver0001:
When i'm running a dive there is only one DIVE master and it's me. If you're in a position to run your own dive then I'll give you the room to do so but if you're not then either you run your dive within the boundaries I set or you get off the boat.

R..
There you go :)
 
RockPile:
Deal. If the boundaries you set are dangerous and stupid, I will get off your boat. Air mismanagement is not something a DM (or you for that matter) is "entitled" too.

If you think you are entitled to do whatever you want, your designation has gone to your head. I think you should relax the caps lock in your writing. I'm not advocating that the cattle band together and overthrow the DM during a dive. I'm advocating that divers be smart and independent minded enough to recognize unsafe practices. And I can't think of a single reason that would seem unsettling to a well-trained, safe DM.

JB

Rock, are you saying the DM acted unsafely when he instructed the hoover to breathe off his octo?[ what was his psi at that moment?] I'm not sure about that one myself. Just off the top of my head I would think it wiser if he told the diver and hoover to ascend to SS. As far as not taking the camera, I think that was a wise move on the pat of the DM.
 

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