Computers - do beginners need them?

[raxafarian]

AaronBBrown once bubbled...


However, most of the dives I do are shore dives. The tables are all but useless for this, as I will spend 20 minutes swimming straight out, get to a bottom of 45-50 feet and turn around. My bottom time will be 45 minutes or so, but I was only in the 40-50 ft range for a few minutes. My computer knows this and gives me tons more time at depth. This is really more important for the second dive, which the tables will frequently not allow me to do.

I have to disagree with the above statement... its my nature:mean:


A dive to 50 ft on tables gives you around 70-80 minutes of bottom time (don't have a table handy.. but that should be close)... take an hour surface interval, and you should still be ok on the tables to do another hour or so dive... If you were only doing 45 minutes, then you have no problem doing 2 dives using tables.

The biggest benefit was mentioned... on a multiday/ multiple dives per day, trip.

 

[Soggy]

raxafarian once bubbled...


I have to disagree with the above statement... its my nature:mean:

Perhaps my example was poor, but I have on several occasions done dives that the computer allowed (and was well within limits), but the tables restricted. Ultimately, that was my point.

 

[Uncle Pug]

AaronBBrown once bubbled...
My computer knows this and gives me tons more time at depth.

.... you would not know this as well???

 

[The Chairman]

why we'd be still wearing big brass diving helmets and 40 pound dive boots... :tease:

BTW he dives with a slide rule and pocket protector too... Welcome to the 21st century!!!

 

[House]

Thanks for all the helpful replies on this - seeing the different points of view is actually quite reassuring!

Whether I get a computer or not, I definitely intended to plan dives using tables anyway - my instructor has repeatedly drummed into me the fallibility of all instruments.

I was looking at the Mosquito because it seemed to do most things for a relatively low price (compared to the Stinger) - I am open to other suggestions though.

Based on what I have read here, it sounds like, apart from monitoring ascent rate, I should primarily rely on tables, and quite possibly postpone buying a computer until after my OW dives are done. I may even buy myself a $20 watch to keep me going in the meantime

 

[JDostal]

NetDoc once bubbled...
why we'd be still wearing big brass diving helmets and 40 pound dive boots... :tease:

BTW he dives with a slide rule and pocket protector too... Welcome to the 21st century!!!

Hehe...I'm sorry...just too funny.

UP, you've got great advice on lots of things, and I respect your opinion....but I'll have to just agree to disagree with you on the point of computers.

 

[Soggy]

Uncle Pug once bubbled...

.... you would not know this as well???

Of course I know that the tables are over conservative in that situation...however, I don't know how to or care to do the complex math underwater that would be required in calculating how much extra time I actually do have. I'm down there to see stuff, not take the SATs. That's what computers are for...making life easier. I should know. I spend all day, every day, working on making software easier and faster for people.

The algorithms that computers use are going to be much more reliable that me writing numbers on a slate.

Pug...do you use a computer at all?

 

[Uncle Pug]

House once bubbled...
Whether I get a computer or not, I definitely intended to plan dives using tables anyway - my instructor has repeatedly drummed into me the fallibility of all instruments.

...but then of course you can... you don't have a computer... yet...

Actually computers are even worse at helping you to ascend properly as they tell you after the fact that you are ascending too fast.... Aaron just thinks that "if my computer breaks, I have some idea of how slow to ascend." but in reality that is not what will happen because he is not practicing depending upon his senses for ascents.... and without practice it just won't happen dude.

As for the Stinger... that is what I use and it is great because it can be set in gauge mode only... and when you get to doing stops it can be used as a deco timer.... Suunto has a much cheaper version for freedivers out now that does the same thing without including the computer portion which I don't use anyway. If I were you I would get that!

$20 watch is OK but it is nice having the bottom timer and depth gauge together right there on your wrist.

Read these threads about ascent indication:
http://www.scubaboard.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=13274
http://www.scubaboard.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=13725

 

[Soggy]

Uncle Pug once bubbled...
Aaron just thinks that "if my computer breaks, I have some idea of how slow to ascend." but in reality that is not what will happen because he is not practicing depending upon his senses for ascents.... and without practice it just won't happen dude.
[/url]

As opposed to the alternative which is getting bent the first few times because you weren't sure how fast you were going?

Observing your surroundings while doing the ascent with a rate monitor provides feedback and allows you to practice using your senses with the added safety of KNOWING how fast your are ascending. Doing it this way can be practicing it.

I'm a musician (my degree is in music performance). I practice with a metronome to hone my sense of time. I know many people who don't practice with metronomes...they usually don't have a very good sense of time and are irritating to rehearse with. There are a few rare individuals that are born with such a great sense that they indeed do not need metronomes to get by, but those that use them still benefit.

Pug, I'm sure you know exactly how fast you're going up or down or sideways. You have many many many more dives than a novice diver. While it may seem perfectly obvious to you what 30ft/min feels like, it isn't to others...they (and myself) are safer with the computer.

 

[Uncle Pug]

AaronBBrown once bubbled...
I'm down there to see stuff, not take the SATs.

Pug...do you use a computer at all?

Let me pull the gossamer veil back just a bit here Aaron... not that it is hiding anything...

If this were about complex calculations I wouldn't be in the running.... I hates math.

Do I use a computer at all? Well I am using one right now.... but if you mean while I am diving... no.


For example Shane and I did three dives Saturday... back to back with minimal SI of 5 minutes.
99fsw for 23:40 minutes
78fsw for 16:20 minutes
55fsw for 14:20 minutes
All using EAN32 and a single LP104
We were practing OW free ascents with stops every 10 feet.
We were not using computers.
If you had been along would your computer have allowed you to do these dives with us?