Cold and unhappy...

[flots am]

Any suggestions as to what I can do to get warmer would be appreciated. I'm thinking first step might be to dive with more air in my suit. I'm diving a 6kg weight belt, DSS SS plate with weight plates, 2 batteries and a 12ltr steel tank. I don't really want to add anymore weight if possible as it's already on the high side for my size and strength.

You need more head insulation. Your head gets 15%-20% of your blood and it's not optional (your brain doesn't lose its blood supply when you're cold).

Keep your head and neck warm and the rest will follow.

 

[buddhasummer]

You need more head insulation. Your head gets 15%-20% of your blood and it's not optional (your brain doesn't lose its blood supply when you're cold).

Keep your head and neck warm and the rest will follow.

Yes, the hood I'm currently using is a little on the large side. I have a small hood on the way and hopefully it will be the tipping factor.

 

[Ouvea]

Hi Buddhasummer:

Ever think of using Argon as your suit's inflation gas? I had to use Argon when I took the GUE Recreational Diver 3 course (trimix and intro to deco) . Many people have told me that scientific evidence suggests it's a placebo effect. However, my training dives were around 2.5-3.0 hours and averaged about 55 degrees fahrenheit. I use a Santi E Motion drysuit with a Santi BZ400 undergarment, and Santi Thinsulate socks. For the most part, I was very comfortable and mildly chilled at the end.

Body composition wise, I had lost 10 pounds as I had just gotten over the flu and basically ate nothing but vegetable soup for several weeks. I don't have single digit body fat percentage but I was definitely in the low teens. At least for me and for one of my naysayers that counseled me against Argon, we have both converted even when not using trimix.

 

[flots am]

Hi Buddhasummer:

Ever think of using Argon as your suit's inflation gas? I had to use Argon when I took the GUE Recreational Diver 3 course (trimix and intro to deco) .
Many people have told me that scientific evidence suggests it's a placebo effect.

Apparently, the physics doesn't work either.

http://www.sierrainstruments.com/techsupport/pdf/im_k_factor.pdf

Air has a k-factor of 1.

Argon has a k-factor of 1.45.

Lower numbers = more insulation, so it appears that no only does Argon not insulate better than air, it's actually worse.

flots.

 

[buddhasummer]

Cheers for reply. I couldn't get Argon locally even if I wanted to give it a try.

I dove Friday and used my drysuit only for buoyancy, holding my safety stop was more difficult that usual, I'm guessing I had some air trapped in the suit but up side I was noticeable warmer. I think I'll add a Kg and use the drysuit for buoyancy next time and see how I get on. I should get new small hood this week so am hoping that helps too.

 

[jbb]

Apparently, the physics doesn't work either.

http://www.sierrainstruments.com/techsupport/pdf/im_k_factor.pdf

Air has a k-factor of 1.

Argon has a k-factor of 1.45.

Lower numbers = more insulation, so it appears that no only does Argon not insulate better than air, it's actually worse.

flots.

ok, I don't know what this K factor is but it is in relationship to N2 so of course air being 70 percent N, Air is 1.0. Not sure what else it says.

Thermal Conductivity of some common Materials and Gases

This table compares Thermal Conductivity of various materials at 25 C and one atmosphere. Not sure how they compare under pressure. I'm assuming it is relative.

Thermal Conductivity of some common Materials and Gases

Air = 0.024
Noble Gases - low reactivity
Argon (gas) = 0.016
Krypton (gas) = 0.0088
Xenon (gas) = 0.0051
Vacuum = 0

Argon, about a two thirds the conductance of air.
Krypton, about one third the conductance of air.

They are now filling double pane windows with Krypton - better insulator compared to Argon especially if the panes of glass are closer together. Now if they had a flexible vacuum undersuit I think I'd be just fine...

 

[Diver0001]

I have a Santi e.motion suit, am wearing a NorthFace base layer, heated vest and a Santi BZ200 undergarment and Kubi dry gloves. Did a 60 minute dive water temps yesterday were 56df and I'm still cold, well maybe not cold but certainly chilly. I'm around 116 pounds of pure skin and bone. I am very sensitive to the cold. I'm a bit disappointed as I thought after such a huge outlay of cash I'd be more comfortable in the water particularly given that our water is not that cold.

116lbs? It's no wonder you're sensitive to the cold.

My first intuition would be to say that the BZ200 isn't the right undergarment for you. Given what you're experiencing you should have probably opted for the BZ400 instead.

If you have enough room in the suit, you could try layering the BZ200 with a light fleece instead of the Northface base layer. That will certainly warm you up but might require 2kg more weight.

R..

 

[buddhasummer]

116lbs? It's no wonder you're sensitive to the cold.

My first intuition would be to say that the BZ200 isn't the right undergarment for you. Given what you're experiencing you should have probably opted for the BZ400 instead.

If you have enough room in the suit, you could try layering the BZ200 with a light fleece instead of the Northface base layer. That will certainly warm you up but might require 2kg more weight.

R..

Thanks for the post. Yes, in retrospect I should have bought a BZ400. The temperature range on the BZ200 says down to 7 degrees, so factoring in my low tolerance for cold and that the lowest temps here are around 13 degrees I thought I'd be fine. I had the suit MTM cut to a BZ200 so am unsure if a BZ400 would fit, I have no way of trying so ordering one could be a costly mistake as I need a MTM so could not return it. I'll look into a fleece layer as you suggest. Cheers.

 

[Belce]

You can certainly ask them. They made the suit for you and understand what is needed to fit those thermals in any of their suits.

 

[jbb]

Well I've got to check out these BZ200 and 400 garments. I don't see any other way of staying warm longer unless it's a heated garment.