Club requires members to sign "no solo diving" contract - So I won't be renewing

[underH2Oman]

Where did you come up with this? I expect a Course Director to have a more intimate knowledge of the standards. An open water card is good to 130 feet, and any of the training staff at any agency or insurance company will tell you that. The 60 foot limit is only during training. Specifically, from the PADI website:

I should have said JOW (Junior Open Water Diver)
I can say NAUI standards limit all Junior Open Water divers to not dive deeper than 60 feet. Not sure if all other agencies have the same limitations on Junior dives but know some due.
NAUI standards state;
-The parent or guardian and Junior diver agree that the Junior diver will dive with a certified adult (18 years of age) diver of the parent’s or guardian’s
selection.
-The parent or guardian and Junior diver agree that the Junior diver will limit diving depth to 60 feet (18m) or less.

 

[Wookie]

Where did you come up with this? I expect a Course Director to have a more intimate knowledge of the standards. An open water card is good to 130 feet, and any of the training staff at any agency or insurance company will tell you that. The 60 foot limit is only during training. Specifically, from the PADI website:

I should have said JOW (Junior Open Water Diver)
I can say NAUI standards limit all Junior Open Water divers to not dive deeper than 60 feet. Not sure if all other agencies have the same limitations on Junior dives but know some due.
NAUI standards state;
-The parent or guardian and Junior diver agree that the Junior diver will dive with a certified adult (18 years of age) diver of the parent’s or guardian’s
selection.
-The parent or guardian and Junior diver agree that the Junior diver will limit diving depth to 60 feet (18m) or less.

Ah, yes. I believe PADI limits 10 and 11 year olds to 40 feet, and other JOW divers to 60 feet.

 

[GrumpyOldGuy]

Wondering why, then, so many charter boat operators want AOW for deep dives (whatever that means...80? 100? 120?.....is it just so the charter operator feels their a$$ is covered or something?

Yup. They feel better.
To be honest there are a lot of people who dive and tend to over-represent their experience to vacation area operators. The AOW requirement is a simple, objective way to screen some of that out. I find it silly and I have experienced that many boat operators will skip the requirement if they know you are not in over your head. This normally means you have dived with them before and proven you are not an idiot. Most can pretty much judge your experience level fairly quickly once they see you dive.

 

[Tigerman]

There is a couple of issues with regards to the cert card recommended depths that may not be obvious if you stick to one area where they are considered recommendations, but might become a bit clearer if you travel a bit..
Some areas have local LAWS that regulate diving and dive ops and the penalties can be devastating for the dive shop or very unpleasant for the divers. also certain insurance companies may only insure you as long as you stay within the recommended limits of your certification card or a specified maximum depth and/or a specified type of diving. I.e. any technical diving and diving beyond 30 meters can void the insurance.
If you want to blow off the recommended limits as just recommendations, atleast make sure you know what the local laws and your insurance say about it before you go do it somwhere new to you

 

[letterboy]

yup. They feel better.
To be honest there are a lot of people who dive and tend to over-represent their experience to vacation area operators. The aow requirement is a simple, objective way to screen some of that out. I find it silly and i have experienced that many boat operators will skip the requirement if they know you are not in over your head. This normally means you have dived with them before and proven you are not an idiot. Most can pretty much judge your experience level fairly quickly once they see you [-]dive[/-]walk upto the dock with your bp/w, long hose and split fins.

fify.

 

[NAM001]

Good going......

Since they deliberately put that in, no discussion should be required. Any requests will be ignored with a take it or leave it. If they are in error in the wording, then there exists a lack the attention to detail that should be expected from any organized group. Ask the question and it goes on back burner. Stop paying your dues and they to will stop and think and then file 13 it. When many stop paying dues they will reevaluate thier policy. Who knows what next years agreement will contain.

This is probably going to become more common. One dive club I belong to handed out a new form that they require to be signed when renewing for 2014. This new form says I will NEVER dive alone.

I would sign it if it said I would not dive alone during club activities, but this says 'never'.

I am not going to ask them if I can cross out that paragraph; I don't let anyone make any changes to the releases I have students & clients sign, so I don't expect the club to be any different.

This club is a great bunch of people, I will have to be sure they understand that it is that contract, not their personalities, which will have me leave the club.

 

[doctormike]

And if you elected to include language purporting to regulate the non-club diving activities of your club members, that it was your last day would be best for all involved.


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I didn't say that and I didn't suggest that any club has the right to regulate non-club diving activities.

It seems like you guys are beating up on a straw man, as far as I can tell, unless the OP confirms that yes, the club agreement in question does stipulate that you can't be a member of the club if you ever dive solo anywhere.

What I meant was that it's pretty unpleasant if one club member expects their fellow divers to put in a lot of volunteer labor planning dive trips, social events, and lectures but then treats them like some tyrant to be battled on principle instead of having a reasonable discussion. And if that's the approach to a difference of opinion, you won't have many people who care enough to do that volunteer work.

There's a big different between disagreeing with a policy and treating someone as the enemy without even hearing them out.

Here's how I would have responded when given the OP's club agreement:

"Hey, not sure I understand, but this agreement seems to say that I can't dive solo anywhere at any time if I want to be a club member. Is that what it's supposed to say?"

If the answer was no, then I would say "OK, I think that you need to edit the language, it's confusing as written, and I'm a certified solo diver and plan to continue solo diving. I understand if you don't want that on club sponsored outings, but that needs to be correctly reflected in this legal document."

If the answer was yes, then I would say "Well, I can't see how the club has a right to regulate what I do on my own time. Can you tell me what is behind this policy? It's pretty unusual as far as dive clubs go."

"OK, I see, well I don't think that this is a good idea at all, for the following reasons. How do members propose changes to the bylaws, what's the process for voting them in by the membership? Because while I would like to be a club member, I can't sign this as written, and I suspect that other divers might feel the same way."

 

[captain]

Really??

Yes, really.

 

[James R]

Did the OP ever get clarification from the club or not?

 

[OtherHalf]

Did the OP ever get clarification from the club or not?

Inquiring minds are dying to know.