Children becoming certified in some countries before 12

[WileEDiver]

Just went back & reviewed the SSI standards... the 40' is a "hard floor" for 10-11 year olds; the 60' is not a standard but rather falls as a "recommendation" for the 12 & over Junior OW.
Rick

My reply was meant to make clarify standard with respect to PADI. The 70' depth allows for a "deep" dive (below 60') so that a 12-14 year old can get a Junior Advanced Open Water certification.

 

[Rick Murchison]

What Rick said.....

I have certified a few 10 and 11 year olds here in the states, I'm primarily a SSI Instructor. I request an interview with the child and parent before we sign them up. Then I want to see the parent dive. Then I decide if it's a safe venture or not. It is totally my call and the shop doesn't influence me at all.

I also had one 10 year old appear bright and alert but after the pool and academics I had him join the scuba rangers for much more experience before allowing them to go to open water. The 10 year old is still there.

As a shop policy we require 10-11 year olds to complete Scuba Rangers before beginning OW training. This has been extremely successful, giving us young open water students who are already fish.
As Mike alluded to in his cite, the BIG PROBLEM with training children is often the associated adult.
I would not be averse to a requirement that the parent of a 10-11 year old be required to be at least rescue certified, or have gone through the open water course with their youngster and received a special "Adult Buddy to a Child" certification.
Rick

 

[MikeFerrara]

Mike, didn't I say that? Unless you were referring specifically to AOW training dives, Which isn't the case. That's the maximum depth for any dives done by that diver (as stated on the JOW C-Card).

I was talking about AOW training dives. From the AOW standards page 3-9

"For the purpose of training, a deep dive is defined as a dive conducted between 60 - 100 ft. The maximun depth is 100 ft and for Junior Divers (12-14 years old) the maximum depth is 70 ft"

 

[Rick Murchison]

My reply was meant to make clarify standard with respect to PADI. The 70' depth allows for a "deep" dive (below 60') so that a 12-14 year old can get a Junior Advanced Open Water certification.

Roger that. (I understand )
Looks like the PADI and SSI wording may be slightly different, but the intent to limit the depth on younger divers is the same.
By the way, SSI standards do recommend that the adult buddy take the course with the child student - regardless of the adult buddy's prior certification level. I strongly encourage that as well.
Rick

 

[WileEDiver]

I was talking about AOW training dives. From the AOW standards page 3-9

"For the purpose of training, a deep dive is defined as a dive conducted between 60 - 100 ft. The maximun depth is 100 ft and for Junior Divers (12-14 years old) the maximum depth is 70 ft"

Agreed. But PADI intends for that limit to apply to all dives (as stated on the C-Card), not just training dives. But since PADI can only specify standards that instructors must adhere to for training, the limit can't be enforced for non-training dives.

Where are the scuba police when you need them?

 

[Rick Murchison]

I was talking about AOW training dives. From the AOW standards page 3-9

"For the purpose of training, a deep dive is defined as a dive conducted between 60 - 100 ft. The maximun depth is 100 ft and for Junior Divers (12-14 years old) the maximum depth is 70 ft"

One interesting difference in SSI and PADI here is that SSI doesn't allow a deep diver specialty for Junior divers. All Junior diver training is limited to 60'/18M (40'/12M for 10-11 yr olds).
A Junior diver can still get a Junior Advanced Diver rating from SSI, however, because SSI's Advanced Diver structure is "4 Specialties and 24 dives" rather than a specific "Advanced Diver" course that includes deep diving.
Rick

 

[WileEDiver]

One interesting difference in SSI and PADI here is that SSI doesn't allow a deep diver specialty for Junior divers. All Junior diver training is limited to 60'/18M (40'/12M for 10-11 yr olds).
A Junior diver can still get a Junior Advanced Diver rating from SSI, however, because SSI's Advanced Diver structure is "4 Specialties and 24 dives" rather than a specific "Advanced Diver" course that includes deep diving.
Rick

Not to be pedantic, I just want to clarify one more thing here. PADI does not allow for any diver under 15 to get a Deep Diver Specialty. Junior divers (< 15 years old) may make "Deep" what are called Adventure Dives (essentailly dive 1 of the dives required for the corresponding specialty certification) to a depth of between 60' and 70'. This allows them to get their Junior Advanced Open Water certification, but again, there is no Junior Deep Diver Specialty certification.

 

[Tanked Monkey]

Then what's he difference between an OW and Junior OW diver?

Both require you to dive with a certified buddy, both have a "recommended" max depth of 66-70'

Sounds like the only difference is in what specialties or advanced training you are allowed to do after the cert.

I'm just saying...

 

[Rick Murchison]

Then what's he difference between an OW and Junior OW diver?

Both require you to dive with a certified buddy, both have a "recommended" max depth of 66-70'

Sounds like the only difference is in what specialties or advanced training you are allowed to do after the cert.

I'm just saying...

The principle difference is that the Junior is a child, and requires supervision.
A Junior OW diver must dive with a certified adult (parent or guardian in the case of 10-11 year olds) or dive pro; an OW diver can dive with any other OW diver.
Rick

 

[Al Mialkovsky]

As a shop policy we require 10-11 year olds to complete Scuba Rangers before beginning OW training. This has been extremely successful, giving us young open water students who are already fish.

We don't require that but enourage it. It is important that the parent be a decent diver. I had one case where the 11 year old was a much stronger diver than the parent. Imagine that