CE Requirement in Europe

[Subcooled]

Vive la France!

 

[kelemvor]

You say: "or if you are anti EU, corruption"

I am for the EU. I might not say "corruption", but I would not say "vested interests" either.

I believe that the M26 standard was created by misguided decision makers, not necessarily corrupt, but mislead by lobbyist from the regulator manufacturers.

Hanlon's razor? Never ascribe to malice that which is adequately explained by incompetence.

 

[Gareth J]

You say: "or if you are anti EU, corruption"

I am for the EU. I might not say "corruption", but I would not say "vested interests" either.

I believe that the M26 standard was created by misguided decision makers, not necessarily corrupt, but mislead by lobbyist from the regulator manufacturers.


Amen.

Those that proposed and pushed through the regulation knew it was only for the benefit of a few manufactures. There where numerous independent organisations advising the EU that is was ineffective, ridiculous, there was no 'problem to be fixed', it would cause additional confusion and would be roundly ignored.

Despite that they pushed it through, why? Ineptitude? Stupidity? Vested Interest?
Unfortunately, it is a repeating pattern.

 

[Subcooled]

Those that proposed and pushed through the regulation knew it was only for the benefit of a few manufactures. There where numerous independent organisations advising the EU that is was ineffective, ridiculous, there was no 'problem to be fixed', it would cause additional confusion and would be roundly ignored.

Despite that they pushed it through, why? Ineptitude? Stupidity? Vested Interest?
Unfortunately, it is a repeating pattern.

That being said,
corruption.

We do wipe our asses however, wiith that utterly supid regulation.
Vive la France!

 

[JMBL]

If the rebreather is not CE-approved they will cause issues in France or Italy as mentioned above. (This will mainly be in the big commercial diving areas, think Genoa, Hyères, etc).

Nobody will care if you have altered your rb somehow, it's all about wether the RB is CE-approved.
So KISS-CLASSIC ohlalala non non non , triton or revo: oui oui oui, you're welcome on my bateau.

I have a friend who dives a KISS-classic and ended up diving OC in Hyères.
It seems the french think it's safer to dive to a 53 meter deep wreck on a 12l single tank on air, than a non ce-approved RB.

Well, try to see it that way : you've got a business to run, and what if the ... hit the fan ? As stupid as any regulation may seem (or indeed is), you've got no choice but to follow it, or be ready to bear the brunt.

Moreover, ask any French diver regularly diving nitrox or rebreather, what's his sincere opinion about M26 and CE, you might be surprised.

 

[Jcp2]

Sorry for not being clear in my wording.

1) Employed divers:

I meant that a professional diver (commercial/military/public safety/sewer/research diver or an employed instructor or dm) probably requires that the employer provides them with safe (CE-approved, for a start) tools.

2) Independent divers:

An independent instructor could opt for non-CE equipment, because it is his own choice. Same applies to those who dive for fun or adventure only.

3) Not so rich divers:

If **** hits the fan and one needs to rely on an insurance, then one can only hope for that the insurance policy does not require one to comply with "safety rules" such as CE-approval and to only dive on dry land etc. etc. etc. If the insurance policy requires CE-approval and there is no free(ish) public health care available that includes recompression treatment, then non-CE gear is a risk.

4) Divers that are (or their employer is) responsible for the safety of customers:

A completely different thing is what is required from a dive buddy or a customer. If there is a customer, there is typically a duty of care, and allowing non-CE equipment to be used thus constitutes a risk: if an accident happens, then can you prove, that the customer was duly taken care of, and that (s)he was informed enough to dive with exotic gear, thus relieving yourself of responsibility (if even allowed by the law)? When a diver is dead, many questions rise.

A dive buddy might also be interested in the capabilities of the gear (especially breathing apparatus) if the dive is planned to exceptional depths or in a challenging environment.

An example: If I am diving to a depth of 30m/100ft in open water then I do not really care what kind of gear you use. Emergency ascent is possible and depth related issues are minor. However, if we ice dive in -1c or near freezing water and swim any significant distance from the entry point, then I DO REQUIRE that you have 1) two first stages, and 2) cold water approved regulators CE and ISO, and 3) dry air in dry tanks. If you do not, I dive solo.

You must skip the DIY section then.

 

[JMBL]

And long live Finland

Better than a national anthem

 

[JukkaO]

And long live Finland

Better than a national anthem

In Finland it was agreed between divers and authorities over 10 years ago that M26 is not needed here at all. 5/8" is officially accepted for divers to use with air, nitrox, trimix, oxygen and argon.

 

[Apexs]

I dive a KISS Classic which is not CE, and it's never an issue on UK boats or at UK inland diving centres, you struggle to get training on non-CE products that may have been bought 2nd hand, although some instructors have found "creative" ways around the rules.

In terms of usage though its not an issue, it's also very rare to be asked for certification proof on UK charter boats.

hi, did you get your kiss training in the uk?

 

[ginti]

@JMBL did the situation in France change over the last 3 years?

I am evaluating a JJ in the GUE configuration, which isn't CE as far as I understand, and if I buy the components and I assemble it I may save tons of money, but won't have any CE stamp... If I go for the standard configuration plus I buy the extra components I will spend a lot more money, but I will have a nice CE stamp and the pieces for a CE configuration if I need it...

Not sure what to do honestly