Buddies kept grabbing/pulling me to ascend faster than computer said was safe
- Thread starter alicia5272000
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To be fair, a computer can probably beep at you even if you wave your hand too fast... since it reacts momentary change in pressure, so all it tells you is that ascent was too fast at a particular moment. We know more than this... the OP's ascent was fast enough on average across the entire time period, not just at one moment or two. When I was fresh after my OW, I also did not feel comfortable rushing to the surface, and I wanted to do my 3-minute stops, no matter what. What's the harm in that? I had my share of disagreements with overzealous DMs, so I can imagine how it went (although nobody grabbed me by the hand). I think it is natural for a new diver to err on the side of ascending slowly, and trying to force something on a stressed person underwater is a bad idea.
KevinNM
Contributor
You shouldn't ascend really slowly from the bottom (you continue at add nitrogen), but you also shouldn't be screaming to the surface unless there is some sort of emergency. I'd be kind of irate and not dive with that guy again unless his or my dive computer log showed something that didn't match my memory of the dive.
I have to agree with boulderjohn on this, or at least agree with the possible reason for the "buddies" reactions here. That is, that the "buddies" felt that at the rate the OP was using up air (which was probably made worse by their interactions), that they felt the OP needed to get to the surface faster rather than slower. While I do not agree with nor condone the "buddies" actions (I have a real hard time accepting that another diver has the right to grab someone and essentially pull them to the surface somewhat against their will, unless they're unconscious), it sounded to me like they felt the OP was running low on air and would have been OOA if not for a more speedy ascent. Sounds like a tough dive overall (90 feet deep for only second time) to have an insta-buddy rather than someone you know (and who knows you).
OP
alicia5272000
Registered
I really appreciate everyone's input. I would like to add that it was never mentioned on the surface that they were afraid I was running out of air. In fact, the additional diver said that I was just going too slow and at 90 feet (computer says avg of 67) for only 15 minutes a safety stop is unnecessary. He was the one who said computers can malfunction and he always ascends by time. But hearing y'alls calculations, there is no way he was doing it 30 ft/min. And my buddy said that I was just ascending too slow and didn't need to take that long. How would I pull the dive information off my computer?
The only situations that I would tolerate such behavior is if a) it is some kind of emergency, b)The buddy grabbing my gear was fresh out of OW and didn't know better (which he/she should) or c) we have farked up our diveplan and need to get to the surface before the Westland Sea King arrives and I am to narced to realize that we have passed the agreed upon total dive time, and only if the increased ascend rate is still "safe" and all deco-obligations is cleared.
In all other situation where someone would touch my gear underwater and trying to force me to do something that I am not comfortable with, is unsafe or is not according to plan, I would respond with the universal scuba signal for "Fark off, aerosol", and some pretty harsh words when we are back in the boat.
Your only mistake was this:
1) "I just shut up because I was on the verge of bawling"
and
2)Agreed to dive with and trust somebody claiming to have been diving for 30 years and "didn't even know how we were supposed to descend" and "didn't know which way was north (with a compass)"
But as other have said, we don't have the buddys side of the story, maybe he was dark-narced and didn't wanna lose face when he was back on the boat (which is still idiotic)
In all other situation where someone would touch my gear underwater and trying to force me to do something that I am not comfortable with, is unsafe or is not according to plan, I would respond with the universal scuba signal for "Fark off, aerosol", and some pretty harsh words when we are back in the boat.
Your only mistake was this:
1) "I just shut up because I was on the verge of bawling"
and
2)Agreed to dive with and trust somebody claiming to have been diving for 30 years and "didn't even know how we were supposed to descend" and "didn't know which way was north (with a compass)"
But as other have said, we don't have the buddys side of the story, maybe he was dark-narced and didn't wanna lose face when he was back on the boat (which is still idiotic)
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Well, a safety stop by definition is "unnecessary", but as you read more and more threads here about deco theory, you will realize that there are very few guarantees about DCS, that a rapid ascent increases decompression stress even with moderate amounts of nitrogen loading, and that another reason for a safety stop is to slow the overall ascent and to prevent rapid ascent injuries like DCS but also barotrauma (which you actually seemed to have had to some degree in your ears). I would absolutely have done a safety stop after that dive if I had the gas, which it sounds like you did.
Yes, I guess computers can malfunction, but I'm not sure what he means by "ascends by time". Unless he is such an experienced diver that he can accurately determine depth with his ears, looking at your depth gauge is important when making an ascent, and no reason why he should tell you to ignore your depth gauge (i.e. your computer) because it might possibly malfunction. Certainly as a new diver trained in 2014, it's totally appropriate for you to watch your depth with the computer, and watch the ascent rate meter.
The only time a slow ascent is a safety issue when you have enough gas is if you are very deep and getting close to your NDLs (or are in deco). This is beyond the scope of this discussion, but in that case, a very slow ascent from depth can actually increase your nitrogen loading as you continue to ongas some of the compartments. That's why a standard recommendation is to ascent at 60 [-]FPS[/-] FPM below 60 feet, and 30 [-]FPS[/-] FPM above that.
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FPM sounds more correct.
To OP:
When more experienced (or any) divers talk, listen to what they say, see if there's any reason for that to be true (ie is it backed up by reasons/facts), if not, screw them. Experience doesn't mean someone is good, and being less experienced doesn't mean you don't know how to dive.
It's never correct to pull someone. However, there's a distinction to make. Grabbing a fin (for less than a second) to make the person turn around because he's going too fast/wrong direction etc is fine by me. Getting a hold of a person is bad. Also, agreeing on the safety stop before the dive is a good thing, or carry your own slate to make it easier to communicate. (although, I'm not sure that would have been useful in this situation)
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