Buckle and Knife postions?

[Henry]

Does anyone find that by putting the knife on your belt tends to put undue pressure on the knife case and your body? I tried putting a knife there and broke the casing off completely (lost the knife).

It probably happened when I bent over. Probably as I was getting in or out of the water. Haven't replaced my knife yet because I can't think of a better place to put it and I don't want to put it on my leg because it's so far away.

Thanks
Henry

 

[RichLockyer]

Does anyone find that by putting the knife on your belt tends to put undue pressure on the knife case and your body? I tried putting a knife there and broke the casing off completely (lost the knife).

As close to center as possible, that way it does not hit your thigh when you climb the ladder.

Second, you don't need (nor even want, you found out why) the hard plastic self-locking sheaths. A strip of webbing sewn to form a sheath works wonderfully.
http://home.earthlink.net/~toddclagett/NovaTech/knifesheath.htm

To be truly DIR (this is the DIR forum, right?) the blade needs to pass all the way through the handle and be riveted or otherwise secured in place so it cannot loosen and fall out. It doesn't need to be a huge "pig sticker"... all you need is enough to cut line.
Mine will cut 1" anchor rope like butter.

 

[Henry]

As close to center as possible, that way it does not hit your thigh when you climb the ladder.

Second, you don't need (nor even want, you found out why) the hard plastic self-locking sheaths. A strip of webbing sewn to form a sheath works wonderfully.
http://home.earthlink.net/~toddclagett/NovaTech/knifesheath.htm

To be truly DIR (this is the DIR forum, right?) the blade needs to pass all the way through the handle and be riveted or otherwise secured in place so it cannot loosen and fall out. It doesn't need to be a huge "pig sticker"... all you need is enough to cut line.
Mine will cut 1" anchor rope like butter.

Is there a DIR difference if I mount the shear sideways or vertical? The pouch that I have in mind is mounted sideways.

I anticipate that if I mount it horizontally just to the left of my crotch strap, that will put the shear handles close to the center of my body with the shears pulling (or pushing) to the right to be retrieved, I should not have problems retriving the shears with either hand.

The only argument that I can forsee is that if I pulled the shear out really hard, my dry glove (or glove ring) might catch the belt buckle as I pull to my right. Although I can't really see that happening.

Henry

 

[VTernovski]

I know...pony BAAAAD, NOT DIR, but required by NJ dive boats unless diving doubles)

just get doubles. man!!! and sell your pony to the next guy

 

[RichLockyer]

Is there a DIR difference if I mount the shear sideways or vertical? The pouch that I have in mind is mounted sideways.

Tough call on that one... I don't see a problem either way as long as you can deploy it with either hand. Personally, I put the Dalton Knife on the harness and clip off the shears in my left pocket, in their sheath.

 

[grouchyturtle]

Yeah right, someone want to pay for the new wing and manifold. Oh yeah, and tanks (119 are to BIG for a midget like me to double up).

I took a look at the book again. The knife is always on the left. The 2 pictures with the buckle on the left are on page 60 and 64. If you look again they aren't reversed. Strange thing is all the pics in that section appear to be the same guy. Sometimes the buckle is on the left, sometimes on the right?

I think maybe they were just being lazy and rushing to get those pictures taken. There is one picture where the knife isn't even centered, it' almost completely on the side.

 

[grouchyturtle]

The buckle is on the right because it passes through the crotch strap loop.
This puts it in a position so that if the crotch strap loop slips, as it pulls back to center it will not open the buckle.

Putting the buckle on the left will create a snag point where if the strap slips past the buckle, it will grab the release and open it as it moves back to center.

And yes... it makes for a crowded side. Canister on the right, hip D-ring on the left. Buckle on the right, knife on the left. Personally, I do use a second buckle to secure the canister, so I don't have to readjust my harness as I switch from my drysuit to my wetsuit (I have the shoulder straps set so they are a little snug dry and a little loose wet).

As far as reaching the knife with either hand, it should not be a problem, because it should be AGAINST the crotch strap, which means that putting it on the right only moves it by 2". If it's farther over than that, it could be a problem to reach... and it would also be responsible for bruises at the top of the left thigh (yes, I've had them).

I think you have it confused. I'm not talking about which way the buckle is facing. I'm talking about the position of the entire buckle, pulled through the strap or not pulled through the strap. Look at those pages in my previous post and you'll see what I mean.

Also with the buckle facing the correct way for a right hand release, by pulling it through the crotch strap, if the strap slides it actually will open the buckle. But I can't imagine how the crotch strap could ever slide that much.

Or do you mean, if it was on the other side, there is a chance the crotch strap could slide over the buckle, and then open it when being pulled back?

 

[RichLockyer]

I think you have it confused. I'm not talking about which way the buckle is facing. I'm talking about the position of the entire buckle, pulled through the strap or not pulled through the strap. Look at those pages in my previous post and you'll see what I mean.

My friend has my Fundamentals book right now, but I can assure you that "buckle on the right, knife left of center" is the correct way. There were some reversed and poorly set up photos in the early (I think first three) editions that were corrected later... can't say that 100% of them were corrected.

Also with the buckle facing the correct way for a right hand release, by pulling it through the crotch strap, if the strap slides it actually will open the buckle. But I can't imagine how the crotch strap could ever slide that much.

That is ONE of the correct ways to do it, and no, there is no way at all that the crotch strap will go that far. That position allows the buckle to secure the canister light as well.
More popular now is to have the buckle closer to center, and use a second buckle to secure the canister, which makes for easier in-water donning and doffing without risk of losing the canister. In this location, it is unlikely, but possible for the strap to slip over the buckle.

Now, think again about the crotch strap. If it IS able to slip to the side, it is going to be under pressure (climbing over the rail, whatever). That is going to hold the loop somewhat open... it's not going to snag the buckle on it's way over.
Now, once it's there, when it is pulled BACK to center, it is under tension. This will pull the loop tight, which will, at the very least, snag and hang on the buckle... possibly pull it open.

It's unlikely to happen, but it is possible, and that is the reasoning behind it.

Secondarily is the fact that it would be too crowded on the left with the knife and D-ring, and the buckle would force the knife too far to the left, causing bruises on the upper thigh. Moving the knife to the right could result in it's loss during in-water donning/doffing, and of course, also results in a problem of your buddy, possibly in need of your knife, reaches to the left side and either can't find it, or pops your buckle.

Feel free to change stuff around to your heart's content... but don't call it DIR.

 

[grouchyturtle]

My friend has my Fundamentals book right now, but I can assure you that "buckle on the right, knife left of center" is the correct way. There were some reversed and poorly set up photos in the early (I think first three) editions that were corrected later... can't say that 100% of them were corrected.

Yup they definitely missed a few.

That is ONE of the correct ways to do it, and no, there is no way at all that the crotch strap will go that far. That position allows the buckle to secure the canister light as well.
More popular now is to have the buckle closer to center, and use a second buckle to secure the canister, which makes for easier in-water donning and doffing without risk of losing the canister. In this location, it is unlikely, but possible for the strap to slip over the buckle.

Now, think again about the crotch strap. If it IS able to slip to the side, it is going to be under pressure (climbing over the rail, whatever). That is going to hold the loop somewhat open... it's not going to snag the buckle on it's way over.
Now, once it's there, when it is pulled BACK to center, it is under tension. This will pull the loop tight, which will, at the very least, snag and hang on the buckle... possibly pull it open.

It's unlikely to happen, but it is possible, and that is the reasoning behind it.

OK that make sense. I've hear some divers also put just a SS Slide Keeper to hold the canister, which is probably what I would do, being the skinny guy I am.

Secondarily is the fact that it would be too crowded on the left with the knife and D-ring, and the buckle would force the knife too far to the left, causing bruises on the upper thigh. Moving the knife to the right could result in it's loss during in-water donning/doffing, and of course, also results in a problem of your buddy, possibly in need of your knife, reaches to the left side and either can't find it, or pops your buckle.

Feel free to change stuff around to your heart's content... but don't call it DIR.

I was thinking of pulling the buckle and the knife through the strap. With a small knife it should fit through the crotch strap no problem. So this way it's on the right and it still has the buckle so you don't lose it. As somone stated earlier the strap is only 2". Even with my small hands, if I reach down to the right, where the knife should be I can still feel the handle.

Yeah it's not DIR, but I guess this is just another example of why I'll never go 100% DIR. I guess I'll always just be kind of Hogarthian. Or maybe I'll write my own book DIR-FLH (DIR for left handers!)

 

[VTernovski]

you are not nearly as skinny as I am, and I have no problems with the Canister buckle and harness buckle on the right side of the crothstrap loop and the knife on the left. and to Tap that off - even with the canister light, I still tuck in the excess light cord into the strap, and I am taller than 6'. Are you going to be at Dutch this coming weekend? I am thinking to camp there and do a night dive. let me know if you want to join us.