Breathing patterns and buoyancy control

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Rick Murchison

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In another thread the subject of breathing patterns and buoyancy control came up. Unfortunately when I tried to split the relevant posts off (Apologies to NWGratefulDiver and Marek K), I deleted them in the process.
Anyway, the basic question was whether the the slow, deep breathing pattern we're taught to use or a short shallow breathing pattern was more conducive to good buoyancy control, and why...
Here's my take (excerpt from my posts on buoyancy about four years ago)
---
Let’s examine the dynamics of a displacement from neutral to see how to use breathing for fine tuning buoyancy control. As a starting point, let’s assume we have achieved perfect neutral buoyancy with half a breath in our lungs. If we are displaced upwards, we will rise until we provide a counterforce to stop the rise. So, we begin to exhale as we start upward, and continue to exhale until our upward movement has stopped. Remembering that an object in motion will remain in motion until a force in the opposite direction is applied, we must have exhaled enough to have applied a downward force – we have become negatively buoyant - to get our ascent to stop, and so if we do nothing at this point we will begin to sink. And as we sink gasses in our body and BC will compress and we’ll continue to sink unless we do something to counter it – inhale. But this “exhale while rising, inhale while sinking” doesn’t keep us stationary does it? To achieve near stability, we must get back to neutral as soon as we stop at a desired depth, so it goes something like this… As we are descending we inhale to stop the descent; as we come to a stop, we must immediately exhale to get neutral, because in order to stop the descent we had to get positive. Continuing to exhale, we will eventually become negative again, and need to inhale before a descent can start, then exhale before an ascent can start, and so forth. With a great deal of practice, we will find that we can breathe slowly and deeply without ever making any noticeable vertical excursions at all!
---
Rick
 
Agreed ...

The biggest problem with short, shallow breathing isn't buoyancy changes ... it's CO2 retention. A slow, deep breathing pattern allows you to eliminate the CO2 your body builds up more effectively.

... Bob (Grateful Diver)
 
Rick Murchison:
With a great deal of practice, ---
Rick

...practice....practice....practice.....Like anything, anyone is pretty much a total lizard until they..me...we... get time to practice.....
 
Fully agree, Rick.

I think that, when working with new OW students and buoyancy, what you describe is the recipe for success in fin pivots and hovering. In my brief experience teaching thse skills, it seems to me that the shallow breathers are the ones with the most trouble, and getting them to do it as you describe is the best way to help them.
 
NWGratefulDiver:
The biggest problem with short, shallow breathing isn't buoyancy changes ... it's CO2 retention.

And it plays heck with your RMV

Nice write-up Rick
 
NWGratefulDiver:
The biggest problem with short, shallow breathing isn't buoyancy changes ... it's CO2 retention. A slow, deep breathing pattern allows you to eliminate the CO2 your body builds up more effectively.
Absolutely. Deep slow breathing works much, much better for me than shallow. A more subtle thing is the "neutral point" of the breath cycle. I tend to be adjust the BC so that I'm neutral with just less than full lungs. I can still rise by inhaling, but I'm also neutral on the average over a whole breath cycle, even while pausing much longer at the top of my inhalation than at the bottom of my exhale. YMMV, but extending the pause after inhale more than the pause after exhale results in lower SAC while still being able to handle fairly high levels of exertion while swimming fast.
 
Charlie99:
YMMV, but extending the pause after inhale more than the pause after exhale results in lower SAC while still being able to handle fairly high levels of exertion while swimming fast.

I can see the logic in that but get the impression you've demonstrated this to yourself. What kind of differences in SAC rates did you see?
 
Rick Murchison:
In another thread the subject of breathing patterns and buoyancy control came up. Unfortunately when I tried to split the relevant posts off (Apologies to NWGratefulDiver and Marek K), I deleted them in the process.
Anyway, the basic question was whether the the slow, deep breathing pattern we're taught to use or a short shallow breathing pattern was more conducive to good buoyancy control, and why...
Here's my take (excerpt from my posts on buoyancy about four years ago)
---
Let’s examine the dynamics of a displacement from neutral to see how to use breathing for fine tuning buoyancy control. As a starting point, let’s assume we have achieved perfect neutral buoyancy with half a breath in our lungs. If we are displaced upwards, we will rise until we provide a counterforce to stop the rise. So, we begin to exhale as we start upward, and continue to exhale until our upward movement has stopped. Remembering that an object in motion will remain in motion until a force in the opposite direction is applied, we must have exhaled enough to have applied a downward force – we have become negatively buoyant - to get our ascent to stop, and so if we do nothing at this point we will begin to sink. And as we sink gasses in our body and BC will compress and we’ll continue to sink unless we do something to counter it – inhale. But this “exhale while rising, inhale while sinking” doesn’t keep us stationary does it? To achieve near stability, we must get back to neutral as soon as we stop at a desired depth, so it goes something like this… As we are descending we inhale to stop the descent; as we come to a stop, we must immediately exhale to get neutral, because in order to stop the descent we had to get positive. Continuing to exhale, we will eventually become negative again, and need to inhale before a descent can start, then exhale before an ascent can start, and so forth. With a great deal of practice, we will find that we can breathe slowly and deeply without ever making any noticeable vertical excursions at all!
---
Rick

1
 
How big of a factor does chest volume play? I have noticed in myself that if I breathe deeply and slowly, I am all over the place. A full inhale makes me significantly positive, and exhaling completely makes me significantly negative. I end up yoyo-ing. When I consciously try to hover, I find myself breathing shallowly and slowly, which works, but isn't sustainable for very long. I keep thinking that maybe my lung volume is larger than normal (you know what they say about guys with big lungs). I also have a very difficult time staying horizontal. If I stop moving, my feet drop like rocks.

I've been thinking about going with steel doubles just to have more mass to offset the buoancy swing and balance me out a little more. Thoughts?
 
Doesn't this all come into play along with proper weighting? I say this because my wife and I went through lots of trouble just figuring out the weights. As many of you may already know, I found that the more you're over weighted, the more drastic your postive/negative buoyancy shift will be when you in/exhale. I think it pays to get down to 2 pound accuracy, or even 1 pound. Only when you have fairly accurate weights, will you be able to use breathing to fine tune.

Actually I find that with proper weights, I don't need much air in the BC at all. (or none) The only airspace that changes are my lungs. Since at normal (mid) breath, I'm neutral, and I don't really have air in my BC, then at any depth, I'll be neutral at normal breath.. or close. Then I can breath deep and slowly alternating between up/down momentum. Actually, I find that there's a "zone" of exhale/inhale that allows enough time for me to inhale, but is short enough to not initiate an upward pull, and vice versa. I think this is the "neutral point" Charlie99 is talking about. The more accurate your weights, the more "zone" you have that is neutral.

siebharinn> from what I read, perhaps you are over weighted? Do the buoyancy check at the surface. (float eye level on surface holding normal breath) To fine tune some more, spend some time underwater and switch weights around. Have your buddy help you hold your weights as you switch around your weights. This is a pretty detailed process. Use all the weight pockets in your BC. Try to find a good weight distribution between your front/back pockets if you have them. If you think you've found a good balance, try to float, holding your breath. (or shallow breaths, for safety) See if you roll over to the side, or your legs drop. Adjust weights to copensate. When you find a winner combination, jot it down in your logbook along with which wetsuit you were wearing.
 
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