Bad photographers at SCUBA Club

[Mike]

This is an interesting subject about touching sea life and such.

I have recently been watching all the old Jacques Cousteau tv shows on youtube, bringing back all the childhood memories of watching them on Sunday nights as a kid in front of the tv in my PJs.

But one thing that really raised my eye brows, if you want to talk about touching sea life.. damn those guys back in the 60s had a WAY different set of thoughts in regard to sea life!!!

Jacques Cousteau and his boys were touching, riding, humping, licking, attaching balloons to, putting to sleep with poisons, trapping and killing everything in the sea and even anchoring to and dynamiting reefs!

 

[cvchief]

Some turtles like being touched...

Jeez, some turtle got up on the wrong side of the sponge that morning....

 

[cicopo]

This is an interesting subject about touching sea life and such.

I have recently been watching all the old Jacques Cousteau tv shows on youtube, bringing back all the childhood memories of watching them on Sunday nights as a kid in front of the tv in my PJs.

But one thing that really raised my eye brows, if you want to talk about touching sea life.. damn those guys back in the 60s had a WAY different set of thoughts in regard to sea life!!!

Jacques Cousteau and his boys were touching, riding, humping, licking, attaching balloons to, putting to sleep with poisons, trapping and killing everything in the sea and even anchoring to and dynamiting reefs!

And we also threw our trash out the car windows littering the highways, used the ocean as the world's garbage dump etc. Back in the early 80's I took the glass bottom boat tour at John Pennekamp Park in the Florida Keys. The trip from the dock to deep water showed me just how stupid people are. The floor of the channel was littered with countless beer bottles, beer cans and other garbage and this was supposed to be a State Park. Things & attitudes change, some for the better & some for the worse until we learn it's doing harm.

As for just how protected Sea Turtles are I came very close to being arrested in St Augustine after rescuing a very small one at the tail end of a Tropical storm. I spotted it in some sea weed washed ashore & it was exhausted. I carried it out past the bad surf to see if it could swim on it's own but it couldn't so I caught it & took it back to the park. It would have been run over if left on the beach because people drive up & down it all day long, and one of those vehicles belongs to a Turtle Rescue program but it wasn't around at the time & we couldn't find their phone number. We phoned the Sheriff's Office to see who they recommended we call & I was IMMEDIATELY warned not to harm it or I'd be arrested & charged, and I was given the same attitude by the Rescue people over the phone, but once they arrived things improved attitude wise. They did however make it VERY CLEAR that had that baby been healthy rather than near death I could have been in serious trouble just for picking it up. They were able to nurse it back to healthy & it and some others were taken out placed in the Gulf Stream where they hopefully survived.

 

[cvchief]

And we also threw our trash out the car windows littering the highways, used the ocean as the world's garbage dump etc.

You did what???

[youtubehq]j7OHG7tHrNM[/youtubehq]

As for just how protected Sea Turtles are I came very close to being arrested in St Augustine after rescuing a very small one at the tail end of a Tropical storm. I spotted it in some sea weed washed ashore & it was exhausted. I carried it out past the bad surf to see if it could swim on it's own but it couldn't so I caught it & took it back to the park. It would have been run over if left on the beach because people drive up & down it all day long, and one of those vehicles belongs to a Turtle Rescue program but it wasn't around at the time & we couldn't find their phone number. We phoned the Sheriff's Office to see who they recommended we call & I was IMMEDIATELY warned not to harm it or I'd be arrested & charged, and I was given the same attitude by the Rescue people over the phone, but once they arrived things improved attitude wise. They did however make it VERY CLEAR that had that baby been healthy rather than near death I could have been in serious trouble just for picking it up. They were able to nurse it back to healthy & it and some others were taken out placed in the Gulf Stream where they hopefully survived.

Good to see the SO and the Rescue doing their part to promote cooperation and engagement with the program among stakeholders. jerks....

 

[Mossman]

"All sea turtles in Hawai‘i are protected under the Endangered Species Act (see above) and wildlife laws of the State of Hawai‘i (Title 13, Chapter 124, Hawaii Administrative Laws – posted online at http://www.state.hi.us/dlnr/dofaw/rules/Chap124.pdf

These laws prohibit harassing, capturing (possessing or removing), harming or killing, sea turtles. Under state law, violation is a misdemeanor criminal offense, punishable by a find up to $2,000 and/or 30 days in jail.
Research on sea turtles both in captivity and in the wild requires federal permits. It is important to remember that sea turtles, both alive and dead are protected. If you are lucky enough to see a sea turtle in the wild, do not attempt to touch or grab it. The recommended distance for observation of sea turtles in the wild is 50 yards. Please remember that feeding, touching, or attempting to ride them could cause distress." If you see them on the beach, please do not disturb them, turtles often haul out to rest. Do not allow dogs to approach them.​

In other words, you don't have a cite to prove that "​

Any physical contact or harassment, regardless if the Sea Turtle(any of the six species) is dead or alive , is against the law without federal permit in the United States." What is against the law is harrassing, capturing, harming, or killing sea turtles. And yes, we are reminded that touching a sea turtle can be considered harrassment if the touching causes them distress, but there is no language in the cited laws that states that touching is illegal per se.

You should also note that these laws are meant primarily to protect turtles when they are on land. Clearly, if we all stayed 50 yards away from turtles underwater, we'd only be lucky enough to see them where the viz is greater than 50 yards.

What the law prohibits is harrassment of any kind. I will submit that the light petting of a sleeping wounded turtle's shell inside a Hawaiian wreck was far less harrassing to that turtle (which didn't even acknowledge our presence) than a bunch of underwater photographers surrounding a turtle and shooting off strobes in its cute little eyes, or chasing after one to get better video. I can only hope that you respect the actual letter of the law and "will be glad to contact a marine officer to enforce the law if someone is engaged in these activities with any of our endangered wildlife."​

 

[ggunn]

In a related story...

A few years ago when my wife first got an UW camera, we were out on an afternoon dive at Tuniche with just the two of us and the DM. She spotted this cute juvenile turtle and wanted to get a picture of it. She finned over toward it and just when she got in camera range, it swam off about 20 feet and settled back on the bottom looking back at her. She swam over to it and just when she got about close enough to get a shot, it took off, swam about 20 feet, and sat back down looking at her. Repeat and repeat and repeat. It was playing with her just like a little dog would do. I just about drowned laughing through my reg at the spectacle.

 

[Sideways]

We had the a similar experience snorkeling off Punta Venado beach. Lil guy kept getting us to chase him, he'd leave us in the dust (so to speak) then he'd come back when we stopped. When my wife got back on the boat, he went over and stuck his head out of the water right next to the boat. Looking at her like.."Hey..don't you want to play anymore?" It was pretty comical.

 

[vincent54]

In other words, you don't have a cite to prove that "​

Any physical contact or harassment, regardless if the Sea Turtle(any of the six species) is dead or alive , is against the law without federal permit in the United States." What is against the law is harrassing, capturing, harming, or killing sea turtles. And yes, we are reminded that touching a sea turtle can be considered harrassment if the touching causes them distress, but there is no language in the cited laws that states that touching is illegal per se.

You should also note that these laws are meant primarily to protect turtles when they are on land. Clearly, if we all stayed 50 yards away from turtles underwater, we'd only be lucky enough to see them where the viz is greater than 50 yards.

What the law prohibits is harrassment of any kind. I will submit that the light petting of a sleeping wounded turtle's shell inside a Hawaiian wreck was far less harrassing to that turtle (which didn't even acknowledge our presence) than a bunch of underwater photographers surrounding a turtle and shooting off strobes in its cute little eyes, or chasing after one to get better video. I can only hope that you respect the actual letter of the law and "will be glad to contact a marine officer to enforce the law if someone is engaged in these activities with any of our endangered wildlife."​

Read the endangered animal act listed. The laws are meant for land or sea. You will be arrested if caught petting a sea turtle in US waters. I would gladly call an officer if someone harasses, no worries. It is not an interpretation of a law it is the law.

No turtle needs a human to caress it gently, that's weird. Leave them alone, they survived millions of years without your help.

 

[cvchief]

It is not an interpretation of a law it is the law. .

Actually all that matter is the interpretation of the law, right?

 

[vincent54]

The laws are pretty clear. There is some allowance for ignorance of the ESA, but secondary offenses usually will be punished. NOAA lists cases won and usually the fine is fairly high when cases are prosecuted. And yes, there are a few Sea Turtle related cases. NOAA will list them regionally, just go to their web site. I will say most, not all, cases that I have read about involve fishing nets and scalloping.

Common sense would say just leave things alone, but some people are hard headed and don't like rules.