OP
CapnBloodbeard
Contributor
What do you find you like more about the ST1?
Atomic....Z2/3....B2...M1.......thoughts?
- Thread starter CapnBloodbeard
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1. Performance (including easy smooth natural breathing)
2. Reliability (Much less need for servicing = less OPEX)
3. Features (AFC, seat saving feature, metals)
4. Lower TCO
5. Great hose routing options
6. Lower profile FS & SS
The above is what I remember now.
Geo7
Contributor
Atomic regs are rated for 300 dives before requiring service, which I find impressive. They do not start leaking after a year if set up with low breathing resistance. A Scubapro Mk2/R190 can do that, but not with the same breathing comfort. Many regs can go more than the usual 2 year interval, but keeping stable, high peformance over so many dives is a breakthrough in reliability imho.
That's in part due to the floating orifice of the 2nd stage, and in part due to the seat material and round piston of the first stage. And the christolube sealing. The workmanship (materials and tolerances) is a league above most other brands, again, imho. And I noticed many techs enjoying working on Atomics (minus cleaning the christolube), even if they dive other brands.
I do however think you need a tech that is meticulous about sealing the reg with no air pockets in the lube, if you want to go >2 years without service on a brass reg (many top it off each year). This needs to be done properly.
Jackie Treehorn
Contributor
minor differences only in handling when attaching and removing from a tank valve.
the yoke mechanism feels buttery smooth no matter how long I go between servicing. Unsure if it is material or machining related. But if feels unlike any other reg I have.
underwater performance is unnoticeable
OP
CapnBloodbeard
Contributor
Thanks all.....would there be much difference in cold water performance between the M1 and, say, a sealed Z3? And the sealing - does that have to be done at time of purchase or can that be added later? (I could be wrong but I don't think 'factory sealing' is an option in Australia...)
Zero difference in performance. No swivel, of course on the Z.
Yes, easy to have it sealed later. But find a good shop that does it properly. No bubbles inside.
drkcurrent
Registered
How does the zeagle F8 fair within the atomic lineup? I am assuming its similar to the B2 being that zeagle is apart of the atomic family
Geo7
Contributor
That's a good question which deserves a reply. I have not dived Zeagle, but others on the board have owned both.
Both brands are Huish owned, and share the floating orifice. The Atomic service interval is 2 years/300 dives for brass (and 3 years/300 dives for titanium). The Zeagle F8 is 2 years or 200 dive hours. Close enough.
It comes down to piston vs diaphragm preference: If you dive in blue clear water (no silt) and rinse your reg well, I would go several years between service with an unsealed brass Atomic (if it passes IP stability checks, as described in the sticky in this forum). If sealed brass Atomic (e.g. ocassional for cold water, or silty water), then I'd service every two years even if it had only one saltwater dive). If I dove year round in cold water (European quarries, Great Lakes deep diving) I think I'd rather have the diaphragm reg (Zeagle) as the sealiing is more consistent. I guess if you do few dives, the Zeagle can be left sitting in a box for a longer time than a sealed brass Atomic.
@lexvil has a lot of experience with both Atomic and the Zeagle F8, perhaps we'll hear from him and others.
Perhaps I should mention that I prefer 2nd stages that have a squared valve tube that keys into the housing. Few are still made that way (Scubapro, Atomic, Kirby-Morgan...). It seems the F8 valve tube is more like an Apeks, which is fine, you just have to pay attention when you tighten the hose to the 2nd stage valve barrel.
I feel like a lot of our reg discussions here are dealing with minute details. All regs nowadays are so well made that you can't go wrong. Oddly, my main advice in the reg forum is don't overspend on regs by getting an inadequate suit. Almost all regs are fine, but nothing can make you hate diving more than a suit that is inadequate...
Both brands are Huish owned, and share the floating orifice. The Atomic service interval is 2 years/300 dives for brass (and 3 years/300 dives for titanium). The Zeagle F8 is 2 years or 200 dive hours. Close enough.
It comes down to piston vs diaphragm preference: If you dive in blue clear water (no silt) and rinse your reg well, I would go several years between service with an unsealed brass Atomic (if it passes IP stability checks, as described in the sticky in this forum). If sealed brass Atomic (e.g. ocassional for cold water, or silty water), then I'd service every two years even if it had only one saltwater dive). If I dove year round in cold water (European quarries, Great Lakes deep diving) I think I'd rather have the diaphragm reg (Zeagle) as the sealiing is more consistent. I guess if you do few dives, the Zeagle can be left sitting in a box for a longer time than a sealed brass Atomic.
@lexvil has a lot of experience with both Atomic and the Zeagle F8, perhaps we'll hear from him and others.
Perhaps I should mention that I prefer 2nd stages that have a squared valve tube that keys into the housing. Few are still made that way (Scubapro, Atomic, Kirby-Morgan...). It seems the F8 valve tube is more like an Apeks, which is fine, you just have to pay attention when you tighten the hose to the 2nd stage valve barrel.
I feel like a lot of our reg discussions here are dealing with minute details. All regs nowadays are so well made that you can't go wrong. Oddly, my main advice in the reg forum is don't overspend on regs by getting an inadequate suit. Almost all regs are fine, but nothing can make you hate diving more than a suit that is inadequate...
I do have experience with Atomic and Zeagle, now I dive Scubapro. When it comes to first stages I prefer sealed, diaphragms are easier to seal so easier to maintain. The Atomic piston is more like a MK 20 than a 25 in overall design, the only real difference being the micro adjustment for the IP on the 25, nice but really of limited use. All diaphragms have external IP fine tuning but you have to open the sealing part to do the adjusting, in reality this makes it easier to hit your target IP but it’s just not something that will be messed with between servicing.
Zeagle 1st is very nice and one big advantage to Zeagle is there is one service kit for all firsts (exception being the Apeks made ones of the first few years) if you have a DS IV or an F8, same service kit.
So when it comes to first stages there are really, as George pointed out, few questions, piston or diaphragm and what is easiest to get service kits and or parts for, they all perform well.
Second stages are where you will have close personal contact with your choices and where choices can matter. Zeagle has always made great breathing seconds, the old ZX is as good as anything out there as far as breathing goes, the F8 breathes as well and has a seat saver that helps keep it doing so a bit longer than the ZX.
George brings up a good point about the alignment advantage of the SP and Atomic design over many others, putting the other type of reg together requires paying close attention to lever alignment to insure it lays square with the diaphragm, the simple act of changing a hose can cause misalignment with will have an adverse effect on breathing not that it won’t breath but it will be harder and less stabile. Hen aligned properly they are excellent regulators.
Exposure protection and fins choice make a much bigger difference, you can get used to 2” cracking pressure but it’s hard to get used to being so cold that you keep biting through your mouth piece or leg cramps from crappy fins.
Zeagle 1st is very nice and one big advantage to Zeagle is there is one service kit for all firsts (exception being the Apeks made ones of the first few years) if you have a DS IV or an F8, same service kit.
So when it comes to first stages there are really, as George pointed out, few questions, piston or diaphragm and what is easiest to get service kits and or parts for, they all perform well.
Second stages are where you will have close personal contact with your choices and where choices can matter. Zeagle has always made great breathing seconds, the old ZX is as good as anything out there as far as breathing goes, the F8 breathes as well and has a seat saver that helps keep it doing so a bit longer than the ZX.
George brings up a good point about the alignment advantage of the SP and Atomic design over many others, putting the other type of reg together requires paying close attention to lever alignment to insure it lays square with the diaphragm, the simple act of changing a hose can cause misalignment with will have an adverse effect on breathing not that it won’t breath but it will be harder and less stabile. Hen aligned properly they are excellent regulators.
Exposure protection and fins choice make a much bigger difference, you can get used to 2” cracking pressure but it’s hard to get used to being so cold that you keep biting through your mouth piece or leg cramps from crappy fins.
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