asked before but differently - opinion & advice

[StSomewhere]

Its no crime to dive a vest BC if that's what you're comfortable with. Vest BCs are called "stab jackets" (short for stabilizer jackets) for a reason, on the surface they stablize you very easily. With a little bit of work you can get pretty much similar results with a backinflate BC, but you may want someone to show you about weight and trim and proper buoyancy for best results. Unfortunately, the ugly truth is that most open water classes do a terrible job at teaching this because its easier to get you up and running with a stab jacket and that's one less thing for them to worry about. (If your instructor has you doing your OW skills kneeling at the bottom of a pool or training platform and you learn "buoyancy" with the infamous "fin pivot", that'll be your first hint.) So if you have someone to help you with buoyancy and trim issues or you learned these from the beginning, the move to a backinflate BC isn't hard at all.

It so happens that I paid a small fortune for a "package" at my LDS including a stab jacket, but if it were me doing it all over again (and my requirements are pretty much *exactly* the same as yours), I'd get the Everything is Special Zeagle and Tusa Package from Scubatoys and save myself a small fortune. Its a heck of a price for some top notch stuff (esp. the upgrade to the Flathead regulator for the extra fifty bucks), and at least if you do change your mind there is a market for used Zeagle stuff, which is more than you can say for a lot of other brands out there.

You could also go the BP/W route, just know that it falls into the domain of tech diving gear (no matter what else you might hear). Many of the BP/W types conform to a entire diving methodology called DIR or "Do It Right", which is a fairly rigid system of diving technique and equipment where everything that doesn't conform to DIR (equipment choice, gear placement, even finning technique) is thought to be substandard and unsafe, and those "unsafe" divers are known in the vernacular as "strokes". Do a search and find out for yourself what that's all about and then you can make up your own mind. After all, as a group these are probably the most proficient and skilled divers you'll find. The important thing for you to know up front is that when you ask some of those folks if a stab jacket or backinflate BC is OK, that goes against the very core of their DIR philosophy. You might as well be asking whether anyone minds if you ride your rice rocket to Sturgis.

 

[Scubakevdm]

I'm a ScubaPro guy my dern self. ScubaPro, ScubaPro, Scub-a-Pro! In fact, I think that there may only be one true jacket BC left today... the amazing and awe inspiring Classic(plus)! Behold! Cast your eyes upon its ruggedly constructed, neoprene double coated 420 denier... marvel at its flow though air cell. Yes, this is the one.
As far as regs go...
Humble yourself before the MK25/S600! Bask in the glory of its incredibly low work of breathing. Know the awsome feeling of 300 cfm of flow, and the delicately balanced, effortless delivery of the S600. Yes, this is the one.
Need fins?

 

[Web Monkey]

I've got a jacket-type BC (Scubapro) and like it quite a bit.

In fact, once you're properly weighted, I don't think it makes a whole lot of difference (for stability or ease of use) what you use for a BC, since it's going to be pretty much empty most of the time anyway.

That said, you do need a BC with enough buoyancy to bring you and your buddy back to the surface if he has a BC failure, and a regulator with a big enough first stage to handle you and your buddy at your maximum depth, a little freaked out.

If you go weight-integrated, you also want to make sure that whatever BC you select retains the weights with some type of positive mechanical device that won't release unexpectedly, but will release when you want it to. Large fastex-type buckles are good, anything that uses velcro-only will eventually fail, may unexpectedly release weights and can cause an unexpected and difficult to control ascent.

The Atomic Aquatics M1 is very nice, breathes like a dream, and is not tremendously expensive. As long as you're not doing cold water diving, you shouldn't need anything too exotic (environmentally sealed, freeze-resistant, etc.)

Terry

I knew that when someone posts for advice here, many of the responses come from hard core divers (keep reading) and every one has an opinion. So I am going to try this differently this time.

For Recreational diving (under 100 ft) with no intention of becoming a tech diver, and for mostly warm to temperate waters with no intention of ice diving, ever, what would your recommendation be if you were to put yourselves in my shoes for a BC and Regulator set-up (1st/2nd), and why not throw in gauges and/or computer too.

 

[crpntr133]

I will make mine short.
BC... Zeagle Brigade, no face plants, only place you can get it is at scubatoys.com. Don't worry Larry stands behind his products and if not then Zeagle will..yes from exerience I know this.
Regs..Apeks or Zeagle.
Computer..plain simple and easy, Aersi Atmos 1

 

[scubadobadoo]

I'm a ScubaPro guy my dern self. ScubaPro, ScubaPro, Scub-a-Pro! In fact, I think that there may only be one true jacket BC left today... the amazing and awe inspiring Classic(plus)! Behold! Cast your eyes upon its ruggedly constructed, neoprene double coated 420 denier... marvel at its flow though air cell. Yes, this is the one.
As far as regs go...
Humble yourself before the MK25/S600! Bask in the glory of its incredibly low work of breathing. Know the awsome feeling of 300 cfm of flow, and the delicately balanced, effortless delivery of the S600. Yes, this is the one.
Need fins?

I really like my mk25/s600 too. Breathes like crazy easy! As for BC's, the diverite transplate I love! However, for stab jackets, that scubapro classic is very nice!

 

[ZenDiver]

Every manufacturer is proud of their product. If it works you can dive it. Most of the opinions are brand loyalty or someone flopping around for a few years till they found something that worked. I have dived so many different BC's its not even funny. In the end you dive inspite of your BC anyways. As far as your regulator goes, every reg made today is rated for 200 feet. So even the bottom tier reg is going to breath at 100 feet.

Forget brand loyalty and go to a shop or two and try the stuff on. Find something that fits and buy it. You may love it or you may hate it, either way you are going diving. I have a BC right now that I hate. Its a very high end tech BC, rear inflation with wings and able to mount doubles and stage bottles. I hate it, got 100 dives on it at least and cant wait to get a different one. Bottom line is decide if your diving in ice or temperate water. If it is ice than go with a diaphram 1st stage regulator, just about all manufactures of reputation make an ice diving reg, when in reality its tropical alter ego is the same regulator most of the time, ex. Sherwood Blizzard/Oasis. Make sure it fits in your budget and go diving. Just my .02

Support your local dive shop if you can and have fun.

Brian

 

[Walter]

Try the Scubapro Classic Sport BC. Sherwood Magnum or Oasis are excellent and affordable regulators. Most blackplate/wing combinations are also excellent. I don't care for Zeagle BCs.

 

[MSilvia]

Many of the BP/W types conform to a entire diving methodology called DIR or "Do It Right", which is a fairly rigid system of diving technique and equipment where everything that doesn't conform to DIR (equipment choice, gear placement, even finning technique) is thought to be substandard and unsafe, and those "unsafe" divers are known in the vernacular as "strokes". The important thing for you to know up front is that when you ask some of those folks if a stab jacket or backinflate BC is OK, that goes against the very core of their DIR philosophy.

On the other hand, there are a lot of BP/Wing users on the board who don't adhere to the DIR philosophy, like myself, and who would still enthusiasticly recommend one for recreational dives with single tanks for all the reasons that have been outlined already.

For Recreational diving (under 100 ft) with no intention of becoming a tech diver, and for mostly warm to temperate waters with no intention of ice diving, ever, what would your recommendation be if you were to put yourselves in my shoes for a BC and Regulator set-up (1st/2nd), and why not throw in gauges and/or computer too.

I would go with a Backplate with a one piece webbing harness, an Oxycheck or Halcyon singles wing, and a single tank adapter. I'd use an Apeks regulator, but nothing fancy. Maybe a T20 or something along those lines. I'd avoid the console, and get a brass pressure gauge, wrist mounted Suunto SK-7 compass, and wrist mounted nitrox-capable computer.

So, let's hear from some folks who use jacket style BCs and what you think of them underwater and on the surface.

I learned on them, and I've used them in the past for my own diving. I like that they're readily available when I didn't bring gear I like, that they do the job in a pinch if I'm just doing an easy dive, and that they keep dive shops I like in business. Beyond that, I don't have much good to say about them.

 

[Dive4air]

Good advice, and very informative. Thanks. It's amazing how many go towards BP&W relative to other types. So that tells me that most divers in the world aren't reading this board. Of all the trips I have ever made....about 40 or dives, across 4 continents, I have never seen anyone with BP&W set-up. That could be because most were vacationers like I was with rental gear. I have to see how that changes when I start hanging out more with the local clubs. Regardless, the most i see out there is jacket style BCs, and recently a surge in popularity for back inflate.

I really appreciate the opinions though because it helps open my mind to the choices out there. One person said it best, love it or hate it, you're going diving. I guess in the end that's what counts. It also appears that most regulators today are built to breath at 190ft, so the choice is more about comfort in mouth, ease of breathing, and dryness. For my purposes, i think I should look at something I can service easily, preferably at my LDS, and I would appreciate a 2 year interval instead of 1.

I am going to the 2 LDS this weekend again to do more research armed with more knowledge. I will definitely post back and let you know eventually what I decided to go with. I gotta give Larry at Scubatoys a call.

Thanks again and keep the advice and opinions coming. I am sure there are plenty of newbies like me, or people who have just never purchased their own gear, who would appreciate the 2 cents you offer.

 

[StSomewhere]

On the other hand, there are a lot of BP/Wing users on the board who don't adhere to the DIR philosophy, like myself, and who would still enthusiasticly recommend one for recreational dives with single tanks for all the reasons that have been outlined already.

Sure, but most are still technical divers at some level. Like yourself.