Aow

[washow88]

One of my co-workers became an AOW diver over the weekend.
According to her,
The dives on Saturday were wreck dives, PP Buoyancy and UW Navigation.
Sunday’s dives were deep dives and search and recovery.
She had a problem with the first dive and I would like to share it with you.
Last August she did her OW and never dove after that. During the OW, her instructor encouraged her to take the AOW because that would “make her a better diver”.
She told me that she was comfortable when they went to 63ft to see the wreck until they started ascending.
She was careful enough during the ascend, but she did not do the safety stop and she was by herself at the surface.
Later the instructor showed up and asked her why she ascended too fast and did not make the safety stop.
Her defense was, she did not know how deep they went because the instructor never mentioned the depth to them.
She thought that the instructor should stop her when he saw he ascending too fast.
I explained to her that he did the right thing by not following her too fast.

I think the problem with the story is:
Asking new divers to take the AOW before they are comfortable with diving just to make some money is wrong.
Take new divers to deep depths without telling them in details what and where they are going is also wrong.

 

[MASS-Diver]

I'm surprised the instructor did not go after her or, at the least, blow off his saftey stop to make sure his student was OK.


That said, she didn't even know how deep they went? Talk about not being aware of your surrondings, but, now she's an advanced diver ready to dive to a 100', good old PADI. Sounds like a combo of a low quality instructor making some cash off a person who, clearly, doesn't have a clue about what to do underwater.


Diving below 60' is not for everyone and should not be viewed as a natural progression.

 

[scubasean]

If a diver doesn't know how deep they were, that seems to be a problem...

Also, it would seem to me that a dive plan should be described (presumably by the DM leading the dive...) before leaving the surface, and the dive plan should include stops, including the safety stop (if only for reinforcement).

I welcome the comments of the more experienced.

--Sean

 

[jbd]

is not mandatory. Not knowing her own depth is not a good thing. With no intention of being mean spirited she is IMHO as Mass-diver indicates--an Advanced diver who has no idea how to dive. This is an accident waiting for a place to happen.

This is one of the areas that I agree with Walter--get 25 dives under your belt before taking AOW.

I also agree with MASS-diver the instructor should have at least followed her to the surface and made sure she was alright.

Hopefully that 63 foot dive didn't count as a deep dive.

 

[Butch103]

1) Should the instructor chase his student from a deep dive? Should he risk injury chasing a student?

2) She didn't know her depth? Where were her depth guages?

3) The instructor should have made her do a least a refresher course? (I assume the instructor didn't)

4) What has PADI to do with her taking the AOW? It was the diver and the instructor who did the dives.

As Scubasean stated, I welcome the comments of the more experienced.

 

[jbd]

would have been a good idea to say the least.

It also seems to me that doing the PP bouyancy as the first dive would have been better than doing a 63 foot wreck dive when its been several months since she last dove.

Reviewing the original post it seems she was in control of her ascent other than doing a safety stop. What ascent rate was she using? 30fpm? 60fpm? Maybe she was really ascending at 100fpm?!?

Instructors have an obligation to attend to a students safety and well being. If a student goes rocketing to the surface then the instructor should follow the student to the surface as quickly as is feasible. This would be,IMHO, 60 fpm and skip the safety stop. This makes the assumption that the instructor wasn't able to stop the rapid ascent of the student at depth.

 

[GQMedic]

I see several problems here.

Apparantly she completely overlooked her instruction in her initial OW class to pay attention to her gauges. She would have then known what her depth was (not to mention, how much air she had remaining) An instructor who maintained very poor control of his students. If she in fact was rocketing to the top, his responcibility is to be near enough to stop her ascent before it got out of control, if that was not the case, and he was watching her make a relatively normal ascent, save that she blew past her safety stop, that's the time to signal the class to stop -n- wait or ascend, his duty next, to ascend feasibly as soon as possible (Here goes another omitted safety stop) and check the welfare of his student. But what REALLY went wrong? I suspect no real plan here. The instructor certainly did not readdress basic scuba skills, and if he did, he missed someone who was totally "in the dark".

Sadly, there was no mention on the instructor remediating that diver's deep dive on another day. Of course, maybe he felt she learned the hard way, then again, maybe he didn't care at all. I hope that is not a mistake she will be repeating anytime soon. This could have been much, much worse. At the very least, that instructor should have counseled that diver about her omitted safety stop. They're NOT "helpfull suggestions", they exist for obvious safety reasons. I'm not going to bash PADI for it, but I do think there's an ethics, safety and risk management issue here. Hopefully her AOW C-card didn't just become a license to kill herself.

Of course, I am not trying to be an alarmist, really, I really wanted to point out off the top of my head some real issues here. Of course, should an instructor blow his safety stop to check a student? If doing so is in his or her own determination feasable, sure, if the circumstances were otherwise, and there was greater risk, you easily have "two patients" where the instructor would have become a secondary problem. There's a real judgement call here. I wasn't there, I read this, I don't know what her instructor was thinking or what risks he believed were acceptable. Maybe her story about being alone on the surface about it being "later" was exagerated, he might have just followed her up at a careful ascent after all. The story is essentially her perception, and since she omitted the usage of her gauges, her perception is in question. Lastly, since you know this woman, as she works with you, perhaps you could buddy up with her, plan a dive with her, insure she understands the plan, go over her use of gauges and awareness, reiterate the need for a safety stop, and make a deep dive with her. Over all, she's bound to learn from your example as a competant diver. If she blows it again, you can simply not dive with her further and explain that you find her an unsafe buddy. Peer pressure can work to advantage.

-Dennis

 

[wreckchick]

As someone who just got home from my classroom for my AOW I do have a tiny bit of insight. First of all, everyone taking the AOW is a certified diver. They (we) should not have to be babysat through something as simple as an ascent.

I was required to take a refresher quiz that has table questions on it and that means that a table is in my hand right now. I quote, "A safety stop for 3 mins at 15 ft. is required any time the diver comes within 3 pressure groups of a no-decompression limit, and for any dive to a depth of 100 ft. or greater."

There may have been a planned safety stop, but if the instructor saw the student ascend to the surface and her feet bobbing above the group there is no reason, IMO to follow her up. She's on the surface, presumably breathing air, and is fine. Better to stay with the students under the water.

I have no issue with students taking their AOW pretty soon after the BOW provided that they understand that it's just another class and only makes them as much of a better diver as the few OW dives the class does, not really an advanced diver. I'm taking the class to gain some more experience under supervision and so I have the card should I need it for something like, for example, volunteering at the aquarium or the zoo.

There's my $0.02

Rachel

 

[PnL]

The first things I was taught in BASIC open water diving was:

A - Always breath - no explanation necessary
B - Buddy system - no explanation necessary
C - Call a dive - know your limits, anyone can abort a dive
D - Dive your plan - plan your dive and dive it!

Whether you're a fan of 'acronymns' or not, a diver should always be aware of the dive plan which includes depth and time. Its your dive so be aware of the dive plan ... if there isn't one, make one before you hit the water.

 

[Washy]

When experience is lacking it is often very difficult to assess the skill or approach to safety that your instructor (or buddy for that matter) will have. I did my AOW last summer in Mauritius, and received a detailed brief and debrief for each dive. I was expected to be fully au fait with the plan, NDLs, etc. and whilst training and afterwards on the boat, I received detailed feedback on improving my technique outside that which was mandatory for receiving the PIC card.

Looking back however, I did trust the instructor implicitly and must sheepishly admit that if he had done something that was “off plan” I probably would have followed like a lemming. Reading the posts on this board has really opened my eyes that the instructors are just human (make mistakes or are just trying to extract money) and not in many cases “all-knowing” gurus. I would now definitely not follow an instructor mindlessly, but that’s more from a realisation that I really am responsible for my own safety.

That said I still would have expected the instructor to either a) surface and find the young lady who would have been obviously absent from the deco-stop or b) been close enough to be in a position to assist buoyancy control at the 5 metre mark…