AOW, Jr vs Regular...

[1000RR]

My daughter and I got certified this past summer (OW, Jr for her - she's 13). We've basically been diving once a month since then and hope to continue that trend in the future. We've also gotten our EAN40 certs. We are very comfortable in the water and have been having a blast down here in Florida. I have thought about (at some future point) doing the AOW but have some questions and maybe a reservation related to the big scheme of things. I/we don't plan to do the AOW just to "have an AOW cert". I am 100% confident that the AOW would make us better divers, just by the nature of taking additional instruction, learning new techniques, etc. I'm just not a "certification" type of person (just for the sake of it), more of a real world "application" type of person. I like the value/benefit side of things and therefore like to be pragmatic in how I spend money in terms of gaining education and real life benefit. So my questions are:

1. My daughter will be a Jr diver until she turns 15, which is a little over a year from now. My thoughts are - since she is limited to 60' being a Jr OW and an AOW Jr only gets her to 70' it seems like it might be more worthwhile to just wait till she's 15 to do the full AOW. Thoughts/suggestions?
2. As mentioned above, we got our EAN40 cards a little ways back. Since this can be one of the elective dives for the AOW, will it count towards that (one of the additional 3 AOW dives)? Where I'm going with this is - I was thinking of getting her and I into a Perfect Bouyancy class next to fine tune our trim and overall bouyancy control. I'm wondering if I take a class here or there, if it will apply towards the AOW down the road... and if so, does that make the AOW any cheaper at that point in time. If not, I guess it's better to just bite the bullet and do the AOW as a package?
3. We are going to Grand Cayman next summer and her/I will do some diving (rest of family not). I priced doing the AOW down there and it seems that once I factor in what the boat trips cost and take that out of their advertised price, the core cost of the AOW is similar to what I see around here in Florida. Seems I can do it for about $270 (plus boat cost). Would you forego doing an AOW while on vacation so you can just focus on seeing the sites, or do you still get to see enough of the sites during an AOW that doing both combined (site seeing and AOW) is a good approach? Thoughts?

Thanks in advance!

 

[Diver0001]

My daughter and I got certified this past summer (OW, Jr for her - she's 13). We've basically been diving once a month since then and hope to continue that trend in the future. We've also gotten our EAN40 certs. We are very comfortable in the water and have been having a blast down here in Florida. I have thought about (at some future point) doing the AOW but have some questions and maybe a reservation related to the big scheme of things. I/we don't plan to do the AOW just to "have an AOW cert". I am 100% confident that the AOW would make us better divers, just by the nature of taking additional instruction, learning new techniques, etc. I'm just not a "certification" type of person (just for the sake of it), more of a real world "application" type of person. I like the value/benefit side of things and therefore like to be pragmatic in how I spend money in terms of gaining education and real life benefit. So my questions are:

1. My daughter will be a Jr diver until she turns 15, which is a little over a year from now. My thoughts are - since she is limited to 60' being a Jr OW and an AOW Jr only gets her to 70' it seems like it might be more worthwhile to just wait till she's 15 to do the full AOW. Thoughts/suggestions?
2. As mentioned above, we got our EAN40 cards a little ways back. Since this can be one of the elective dives for the AOW, will it count towards that (one of the additional 3 AOW dives)? Where I'm going with this is - I was thinking of getting her and I into a Perfect Bouyancy class next to fine tune our trim and overall bouyancy control. I'm wondering if I take a class here or there, if it will apply towards the AOW down the road... and if so, does that make the AOW any cheaper at that point in time. If not, I guess it's better to just bite the bullet and do the AOW as a package?
3. We are going to Grand Cayman next summer and her/I will do some diving (rest of family not). I priced doing the AOW down there and it seems that once I factor in what the boat trips cost and take that out of their advertised price, the core cost of the AOW is similar to what I see around here in Florida. Seems I can do it for about $270 (plus boat cost). Would you forego doing an AOW while on vacation so you can just focus on seeing the sites, or do you still get to see enough of the sites during an AOW that doing both combined (site seeing and AOW) is a good approach? Thoughts?

Thanks in advance!

#1: it doesn't matter. Once she reaches the age, converting her card to a full OW or AOW card is an administrative procedure. There is no further diving involved. I thought the age was 14, btw, not 15 but you may be right. i would have to look it up.

#2: yes

#3: I would personally recommend doing AOW where you intend to dive the most.

R..

 

[maj2]

My daughter is now 14. She did her Jr OW at age 10, and Jr AOW at age 12. She also had here EAN certification prior to doing her AOW.

For us, the prior specialties were not that big of a deal for her AOW. She did the full AOW course, and just chose a set of dives that gave her a broader experience. The cost was going to be about the same either way.

Where does your daughter want to go with her diving? My daughter had set herself a goal of becoming a Jr Master Scuba diver, and actually got into a bit of a competition with another Jr diver of the same age. She needed AOW and Rescue to get there, so she did them as a Jr diver. I guess the question is... What does your daughter want out of diving, and how soon does she want it?

Also consider the sites that you might be diving, or any potential travel. When we went to San Jose del Cabo, the 60ft Jr OW limit would have drastically reduced the number of potential dives sites that we could do. The extra 10ft may not seem like much, but it opened several extra dive sites for us on that trip, and the dive op was quite happy to have that extra flexibility and variety.

 

[Nianne]

AOW and AOWJ are the same, there's just a limitation on depth and yes, it's better to do it than pick some courses, so I agree with Diver0001.
For the last point, I don't really see a difference between doing it on holidays and at your place since it seems to be the same condition.
It may be more fun for you daughter to do it with other kids though. (Unless it's the thing that you share)

 

[tursiops]

2a. Your EAN40 certs do not count toward AOW unless you did them with dives. Usually, the EANx class is dive-free,
2b. Any specialties earned prior to doing AOW may count toward the AOW, but it will depend on the AOW instructor/shop. Also, the price may be negotiable. For example, if you already have Peak Performance Buoyancy, the n you only need 4 more "adventure" dives (i.e., the first dive of four more specialties), but you can't do 4 in one day (it is three max), so it will still be a two-day class, and so the price may not be reduced. On the other hand, if you had two specialties prior to AOW, with just three dives left, it might seem possible to do the class in just one day (and thus get a much better price), but there is a problem with this: it is recommended to do the deep dive as the first dive of a day, but it is also recommended NOT to do the deep dive as the first of the AOW, because it is a dive with more constraints and higher jeopardy, and the instructor will want to have dived with the student before that deep dive so as to know what they are dealing with. If I were the instructor in this situation, I would plan to do two non-deep dives in the morning, take a VERY long lunch break and do lots of paperwork and knowledge reviews and discussion about the (mandatory) "Think Like a Diver" part of the program, and then after lots of out-gassing, do the Deep dive as the final one for the course.

 

[1000RR]

Thanks for all the insight from everyone. A couple follow-ups to them:

• Correct, on the EAN40 class we took - it was dive-free since it really isn't a knowledge course you need a dive for (we breath the same once we're under).
  
• As far what she wants to do with diving, interesting question. I haven't asked her but I suspect it's the same as me for now - just to see a whole new world and enjoy it together. One day she says she wants to be a Marine Biologist so who knows, maybe this experience could help. I also told her in college, she could go be a DM on a dive boat and have some fun and make a little stipend on the side. But in general, it's just to explore.
• Interesting on the extra 10' making a difference, I would not have really guessed. I've heard that once you get out of the Country (friend of mine has gone with his Jr's, etc. to Mexico and South America) that the 60' rule many times is not fully abided by and he described it as - first couple dives, the DM watched and evaluated and then took he and his daughter(s) on deeper dives subsequent to that (subsequent days). Not saying that's a great approach, just that it happens. He and his daughters are now all AOW, Rescue, and maybe another?! For right now, we're satisfied with her 60' limitation as there is tons to see above that and many times prettier to look at. I was thinking that if we waited till she was 15, then our Deep dive would likely be a bit deeper than if she was a Jr, and it might be a more well rounded experience.
• I'll have to think about whether or not we want to do the AOW while we're down in Grand Cayman. What I don't want to do is take away from the things to see underwater at GC because we decided to do AOW and obviously there's a level of focus specific to the course that would be needed... whereas otherwise we might just be diving the dives and enjoying the scenery.

 

[tursiops]

Thanks for all the insight from everyone. A couple follow-ups to them:

• Correct, on the EAN40 class we took - it was dive-free since it really isn't a knowledge course you need a dive for (we breath the same once we're under).
  
• As far what she wants to do with diving, interesting question. I haven't asked her but I suspect it's the same as me for now - just to see a whole new world and enjoy it together. One day she says she wants to be a Marine Biologist so who knows, maybe this experience could help. I also told her in college, she could go be a DM on a dive boat and have some fun and make a little stipend on the side. But in general, it's just to explore.
• Interesting on the extra 10' making a difference, I would not have really guessed. I've heard that once you get out of the Country (friend of mine has gone with his Jr's, etc. to Mexico and South America) that the 60' rule many times is not fully abided by and he described it as - first couple dives, the DM watched and evaluated and then took he and his daughter(s) on deeper dives subsequent to that (subsequent days). Not saying that's a great approach, just that it happens. He and his daughters are now all AOW, Rescue, and maybe another?! For right now, we're satisfied with her 60' limitation as there is tons to see above that and many times prettier to look at. I was thinking that if we waited till she was 15, then our Deep dive would likely be a bit deeper than if she was a Jr, and it might be a more well rounded experience.
• I'll have to think about whether or not we want to do the AOW while we're down in Grand Cayman. What I don't want to do is take away from the things to see underwater at GC because we decided to do AOW and obviously there's a level of focus specific to the course that would be needed... whereas otherwise we might just be diving the dives and enjoying the scenery.

Your last bullet is a fair concern; not fun to go on vacation and spend all your time working on classes! However, only the AOW navigation dive is really focused; you don't get to do much but navigation on that dive! On all the others, you do your skills, then have a nice dive, with only moderate "interference" during the dive. You still see lots.

 

[Landau]

"You Still see lots" - all depends on the location. My AOW the deep dive was great for training, bad for sightseeing. Swim down a gently sloping sand bottom to 100 feet, do stuff and then back up the same slope. I think I saw a crab and maybe an anemone. Still I was excited as it was my first time past 50 feet. I remember being nervous heading down.

 

[TMHeimer]

I always throw in "Do all courses at home you can just dive on vacation". For some that is not possible, but probably doable in your location if you choose.

 

[1000RR]

I always throw in "Do all courses at home you can just dive on vacation". For some that is not possible, but probably doable in your location if you choose.

Agree... pretty much what I think I've concluded. Where we live there are all kinds of places to take some courses, so why do it while I'm on vacation... Just enjoy those for what they are and take it all in...