AOW Disappointment

[MikeFerrara]

Advanced Plus is no longer a class. Once upon a time, PADI offered it as an option to their AOW course. It included more dives (9 if memory serves) and actual academics. It was a fairly good advanced course, but since it didn't produce enough revenue, they axed it.

When I first became a PADI instructor the Advanced plus course was still around. I'd have to look back though old instructor manuals to find the standards but if I remember right (and I may not) the academics were exactly the same as the DM course only without the testing requirements. And, yes, I believe there were more dives.

I'm sure lack of sales was the reason for doing away with the course but you have to wonder why there was a lack of sales. It's not too uncommon for charters to require AOW for access to certain dives. My opinion is that divers and shops only do what is required for access. I think it's a shame that divers don't enjoy learning and instructors don't enjoy teaching, diving related things like decompression theory, dive physics, physiology, dive equipment ect.

Time to stop refering to this sport as diving and start calling it underwater tourism.

 

[SparticleBrane]

Time to stop refering to this sport as diving and start calling it underwater tourism.

That's more or less what it is: hand-holding by tour guides. :shakehead
Personal responsibility and thinking is at an all-time low.

 

[3-Ring Octopus]

Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeFerrara
Time to stop refering to this sport as diving and start calling it underwater tourism.

That's more or less what it is: hand-holding by tour guides.

Personal responsibility and thinking is at an all-time low. Today 07:16 AM

I'm glad I don't do a lot of warm-water diving. I really don't feel that those comments apply around here. There isn't a lot of hand-holding around here, and unless a small charter with 8-10 divers can be considered a "cattle boat"..lol...there isn't any of that either. If you're an active local diver, you're pretty much "forced" into thinking/planning for yourself/your buddy. The car-ride to the dive site is usually packed with "what-if" drills or what you saw the last time you were at a particular site.

It's just an entirely different animal depending on where you are.

Cheers,
Austin

 

[Steve R]

As I said, AOW is not a course, it is a marketing term that dive shops now use. And I also said that PADI calls the series of dives that could lead to a AOW certification, Adventures in Diving. As such, a dive shop CAN require a night dive as part of THEIR AOW course. They coud also call it the Super Duper Special DIving Fun Yo Much Course if they wanted and require the Double Dome Speciality. Furthermore PADI does not call it a COURSE, they call it a PROGRAM, which is what is written in my instructor manual. Since you are not a PADI instructor I wouldnt expect you to know this. However, these new divers might think you do, so stop abusing that mistrust.

lol

http://www.padi.com/padi/en/kd/advancedopenwater.aspx

FYI there JV, not that this is even close to the real issue, which you've yet again shown yourself to have no clue about.

Long after Padi started telling you to call it the Adventures in Diving program in your manual, they re-did their own web site, and quite clearly call it an AOW course. They've played you very well, and as Walter said, they are deceiving just about everyone.

Again, all you have is fact-less retoric. You were made that way by Padi design, and are the spitting image of the typical padi instructor with zero education except a padi one, which shows in spades.

Abusing mistrust you say? lol I guess you don't know who Walter is or what he has done to better those us that know of his trials over the last several years. If you had a clue, you'd be ashamed of yourself for that comment.

But then I repeat myself. Nothing but pointless retoric dude, and shows how good a number they do on their instructors, and in turn their divers.

As the recreational dive agency leader, they are a complete disgrace to those that require even a modicum of skill and diver knowledge.

 

[jviehe]

lol

http://www.padi.com/padi/en/kd/advancedopenwater.aspx

FYI there JV, not that this is even close to the real issue, which you've yet again shown yourself to have no clue about.

Long after Padi started telling you to call it the Adventures in Diving program in your manual, they re-did their own web site, and quite clearly call it an AOW course. They've played you very well, and as Walter said, they are deceiving just about everyone.

Again, all you have is fact-less retoric. You were made that way by Padi design, and are the spitting image of the typical padi instructor with zero education except a padi one, which shows in spades.

Abusing mistrust you say? lol I guess you don't know who Walter is or what he has done to better those us that know of his trials over the last several years. If you had a clue, you'd be ashamed of yourself for that comment.

But then I repeat myself. Nothing but pointless retoric dude, and shows how good a number they do on their instructors, and in turn their divers.

As the recreational dive agency leader, they are a complete disgrace to those that require even a modicum of skill and diver knowledge.

The fact still remains, I am a current PADI instructor, Walter is not, nor are you. Who, then is better qualified to speak on what PADIs current philosophy is on training? I think I and others have adequetly pointed out that PADI has little to do with the dissapointment felt by the OP. The dive center is the problem, and should not be visited again. Beyond that you can gripe all you want about PADI. I simply am not going to allow misinformation to be spread.

 

[Walter]

Your pro-PADI bias is showing which results in you spreading misinformation.

 

[plot]

The fact still remains, I am a current PADI instructor, Walter is not, nor are you. Who, then is better qualified to speak on what PADIs current philosophy is on training? I think I and others have adequetly pointed out that PADI has little to do with the dissapointment felt by the OP. The dive center is the problem, and should not be visited again. Beyond that you can gripe all you want about PADI. I simply am not going to allow misinformation to be spread.

Why is it, when a dive shop simply meets the minimum requirements set by PADI, and the customer is not satisfied or feels they didn't get much out of the course for the money they put in for it, that it's the dive centers fault for not going WAY ABOVE AND BEYOND PADI's set requirements?

Maybe if PADI (and I know we're picking on PADI in this particular thread, but the same can be said for the other agencies too), raised the bar a little higher and all around and made an advanced course that was truely advanced... we'd see a whole lot less of these threads.

 

[jviehe]

Why is it, when a dive shop simply meets the minimum requirements set by PADI, and the customer is not satisfied or feels they didn't get much out of the course for the money they put in for it, that it's the dive centers fault for not going WAY ABOVE AND BEYOND PADI's set requirements?

Maybe if PADI (and I know we're picking on PADI in this particular thread, but the same can be said for the other agencies too), raised the bar a little higher and all around and made an advanced course that was truely advanced... we'd see a whole lot less of these threads.

Its a businesses responsibility to deal with their customer service. The complaint the OP posted is not about the PADIs requirements, but the dive centers adaptation to these requirements. They did not deliver on the promises they made. This has nothing to do with PADI.

 

[jviehe]

Your pro-PADI bias is showing which results in you spreading misinformation.

Everything I have posted is factual based on my training an experience as a PADI Instructor and the instructional material provided to me by PADI. What is your expertise on PADIs courses, exactly?

 

[SteveDiver]

This is like beating a dead dog....over and over and over again....What one makes of their education is up to them regardless of the institution. There are great Instructors and poor ones. Students that receive poor training should empower themselves to ensure that they acquire adequate knowledge either by: taking a course over again, finding and "interviewing" a new instructor, and asking for references. I had a great Instructor that went above and beyond to the as so stated in this post "non-existent standards". Regardless of the agency from my understanding it is the instructor that can make or break the class period. Although, I learned a lot from my instructors I learned MUCH more on my own and from other divers. Everyone needs to get along and realize that no one agency is better than the other, it is all in the hands of the instructor and the student. The principle remains the same.

Those whom say "my agency is better than your agency" are seriously misguided. There are those who will learn because of their hunger to learn, those who put down another agency because of their insecurity (you know the ones who put others down because they "think" they are better than the other) and those who collect c-cards thinking that they are "somebody". Stop! we are all adults here, let your egos rest and if it will help- "You are the BEST in everything" - "The agency that certified you is top notch" - "You are so perfect you can walk on water". We are adults, let it rest already who cares??? This debate will NEVER be resolved kind of like religion and politics.

To the orginal poster- Look bud, if you were not comfortable with your training or what you received take ownership of your training and get a refund and re-take a class with another instructor (interview the instructor to see if he/she has an inflated head if so stay away). Do not rely others to tell you if you received adequate training only YOU will know that.