Anyone else been diving long enough to see the humor in this?

[pcosens]

I quote from the OMS site:

"Our diver base over the years has overwhelming indicated a preference for high pressure/high volume cylinders of the same capacity as the OMS low pressure cylinders"

Cool - now we have cylinders that require 3400+ psi COLD to achieve advertised volume.

1 What shop do you know of that will pump 3400 cold psi on a busy weekend? Hey, any weekend for that matter. I'm speaking from 30 years experience in the dive industry . . .

2 The dive industry is SHRINKING at an alarming rate - shops are struggling to hold on - and they are going to invest in equipment to deliver these pressures in a REAL working shop? Yes, it's easy to pump 3400 psi on any given day, any given compressor. Try maintaining reserve banks or continuous fill these cylinders in a real working volume shop! Can you say "tapped by 10am Saturday?"

3 Hey - gas mixing guys/girls - now we can all try to get high O2 mixes from LP O2 supply cylinders via PP blending!

Positive note - they ARE really shiny and pretty . . . .

Now that the old F##t has finished his rant . . .

Anyone want to sell their nasty, old, out of fashion Faber 121s or 112s?? I'll take them off your hands, clear your shelves for the NEW tanks That white epoxy coating might also be harmfull - I'll do some checking and get back to you on that . . .

PM me.

Oh - if by chance you might DISagree with me - share your thoughts here please! I'm all ears.

Paul

 

[jonnythan]

You might be amused to find out that the 130cf tank is basically the PST LP 104 rated for 3442 instead of 2400 psi.

I fail to see the problem with that.

Also, OMS doesn't actually make any 3442 psi tanks. PST is the only company that actually has any of those on the market. OMS apparently just stole their spec chart and published it sometime last year.

 

[pcosens]

You might be amused to find out that the 130cf tank is basically the PST LP 104 rated for 3442 instead of 2400 psi. I fail to see the problem with that.

Also, OMS doesn't actually make any 3442 psi tanks. PST is the only company that actually has any of those on the market. OMS apparently just stole their spec chart and published it sometime last year.

I'm well aware that the LP Fabers were always "detuned" HP tanks from the EU spec. There was JOY in knowing you had HUGE headroom in the cylinder.

Brands don't matter to me - the HP issue is central. PRACTICAL implementation of the theoretical advantages of HP over LP just will not widely happen. Fashion over real function.

How much air do you need? (exclude cave specialties, LIMITED extreme scenarios). Breathing rate X depth x desired BT - how long do you want to stay? Man, even I can get sick and tired of looking at an intact 19th century wooden schooner after a while.

jonnythan - I'm thinking we share a common aquaintance - Ralph - does that ring a bell?

Paul

 

[pt40fathoms]

Jonnythan is right. From what I know (I just purchased 2 of em) the tanks are 120cf at 3442 psi, 104cf at 3000 psi and 90cf at 2640. From what I've also been told, they are merely the old 104cf tanks with a certified pressure rating up to 3442 psi. Seems they were a lot tougher than we originally thought. The rub here is that your old 104cf tanks, even though supposedly the exact same as the new ones, can not be filled to 3442 because they "have not been certified to those pressures". Read: lawyers and insurance companies have not given the OKEY DOKEY to do so.

This information, like a host of other information may be incorrect, and they are in fact a completely new tank....but I think not.

 

[jonnythan]

I'm well aware that the LP Fabers were always "detuned" HP tanks from the EU spec. There was JOY in knowing you had HUGE headroom in the cylinder.

Brands don't matter to me - the HP issue is central. PRACTICAL implementation of the theoretical advantages of HP over LP just will not widely happen. Fashion over real function.

How much air do you need? (exclude cave specialties, LIMITED extreme scenarios). Breathing rate X depth x desired BT - how long do you want to stay? Man, even I can get sick and tired of looking at an intact 19th century wooden schooner after a while.

jonnythan - I'm thinking we share a common aquaintance - Ralph - does that ring a bell?

Paul

If it makes you feel better, buy a 3442 psi cylinder and only fill it to 2640. You can even call it a low pressure tank if you want. It will have the same characteristics as the older LP tanks

I don't believe I know anyone named Ralph...

 

[pcosens]

Seems they were a lot tougher than we originally thought.

I think you've missed my point. I WAS around when the LP appeared for the first time. "We" all were aware that they were detuned HP cylinders.

There is a dgree of irony here apparent ONLY to us old f##ts!

The rest of the old guys are reading this and laughing - they're smart enough not to respond! Probably out diving some remote coral reef as we speak . . .

P

 

[pcosens]

Do yourself a big favor and speak to some resort owners, destination dive shops / fill stations (not the guys trying to sell you the HP tanks) and get their opinion on how likely it is that you will get a full tank on a busy summer weekend (in my neck of the woods anyways).

Look back at the history of dive cylinders - Sherwood produced (sold) a HP cylinder right along side the OMS/Faber / younameit LP cylinders. They were pretty popular . . . NOT!

While you are at it - look up high partial pressures of O2 and it's impact on steel cylinders when stored . . . then pump up to 3400+ like everyone else!

P

 

[FIXXERVI6]

I like the PST take on it, E8130, if you pump it up, otherwise its an old school 104 for the most part, I don't see the problem because in cave country if you have a 104, most likely your not running it at 2640 anyway, 3300 - 3500 is more like it, so in that case, not a lot of difference, call it a 104 that you overpressure or an E8 that is rated for it, to me its pretty much the same tank.

 

[jonnythan]

I dunno about resorts, but I've never been anywhere that had a problem filling my Al 80s to 3000 psi, and I haven't had any issues getting my 130s filled to rated pressure (except my LDS guy insisting they had the wrong valve).

I'd much rather have a 130 with 113cf @ 3000 psi than a 104 with 104cf @ 2640 psi anyway.. especially when they're the same tank

 

[lamont]

So, first of all the E8-130s are a different alloy than the LP104s. They weight 5# less than the old LP104s. Arguably this is a little meaningless since it just means another 5# on the weightbelt. But the point here is that the metal is different. They're also a different DOT rating, and I expect that the E8-130s are rated for the same number of fill cycles before failing hydro at 3442 psi as the LP104s are rated for at 2640. Sure you can crank up LP104s routinely to 3500 psi, but it'll fail hydro sooner than a E8-130.

Meanwhile, even if I'm only getting 3200 psi cold in an E8-130, I'm still getting more gas than a cold fill of anything other than an LP120. what you really want to be comparing is water volume, and the LP120 is the only tank which has a larger water volume that I'm aware of...

And if you don't hoover down enough air to make a difference, congrats... With a 130 I can be restricted by gas at about 60 fsw (below that I'm restricted by deco, and above that usually by warmth).