A question for the old salts here...

[emcbride81]

Actually two questions. First, for those of you that have mastered it, how long/how many dives did it take to perfect your bouyancy? Is the PADI Bouyancy class worth the money or can I just use the advice from the people on this board?

Secondly, this is a what would you have done situation. I was recently diving a local lake with two people I met there. One recently certified, the other had been out of the sport for several years but and was just getting back into it. The first dive maxed at 71 ft, one diver got cold and we came up. We did not make a safety stop as we were only down for a few minutes. I did a solo dive at max 64 feet for 15 minutes, and then a hour and a half later we did another dive together where we maxed at 87 feet. We decided that on this last dive that we would do a safety stop. I hit the minimum air level first so we went up. As we got to about 20 feet I began to get neutral, however they shot up. I stayed at 15 feet for a few seconds, but I began to worry about the other two and decided to go up. After reaching the surface, I found them ok and they apologized for not being able to stop. About an hour later as I was driving home I got extremely fatigued. Luckily I was close to my house, so I made it there safely.

I know that I pushed my luck a little, but my concern was with the safety of my buddies. On the other side of the coin, I believe that every diver should look at their safety as their responsibility and only theirs. I am still obligated to make sure I get home to my wife at the end of the day.

Thoughts?

 

[VK2ICJ]

I would never compromise my own safety. Did you plan your dives? Did you follow the plan? Did you use a computer? Did the computer complain about your dives?

 

[gcbryan]

Regarding taking a class to perfect your buoyancy or using the advise from this boad to do the same... take the class or go diving with a more experienced diver who can help you. You're not going to improve your buoyancy by reading a post on the internet or in a book for that matter.

Moving on to your second question...I don't think you should be diving solo with the limited number of dives you have, I would plan to do a safety stop on every dive, and if you were managing your air supply correctly you wouldn't have had to choose between a safety stop or running low on air.

Whether to stay with a buddy or not depends on the individual circumstances. I wouldn't be diving with someone I didn't know to a depth where missing a safety stop would concern me.

 

[philmayer]

Bouyancy is something that will take you alittle while to get the hang of. I would get 20-30 dives under your belt, then you'll better understand the PPB class.

As far as the lake dive...........you screwed up in several ways, several times.

Yes, it was good that you checked on the other divers. BUT your first responsibility is to keep yourself alive.

The diver who had not dived in several years who could not control his ascent needs to get into a refresher course. He could have killed you. And his buddy.

You're VERY lucky that after diving to 87 feet and ascending without completing a safety stop that you didn't get a chamber ride.

After checking on the divers and finding them OK, you should have immediately returned to 15 feet and completed a long safety stop.

NEVER compromise your safety.

 

[spectrum]

Question one.... Who the heck is perfect? But I think I know what you are asking. After some weight placement advice from a board member on my 7th dive dive 8 was a quantum leap to what I was hoping to feel like by the end of the season 50+ dives latter. I'm still growing in technique and awareness but by dive 8 I really felt in control.

I'm sure PPB is worthwhile like any other class is you have an instructor who is committed to making you a better diver. If you read a lot there and dive with a spirit of continuous improvement you will come along.

As for those dives You must always keep number 1 fist and that means you do not compromise your well being for anyone. Sure you want to be a good buddy but one big rule is not to end up with 2 divers in trouble when you only had 1.

Your 2 dives were in what many would call reverse order for max depth but even that is challenged today. What you were lacking was the gradual return to the surface. A mid stop and 15-20' safety stop are now becoming SOP.

The only 2 times I felt wiped out after diving were dives that for various pratfalls had several returns to the surface for 40 feet or so. They weren't out of control ascents but they were direct. In all likelihood it was a case of self inflicted sub clinical DCS. Just enough bubble action to make me feel like crap that fortunately went no further.

If you make your ascents gradual, do your stops and make the final ascent as gently as you can then take it easy after the dive you can go hope feeling great or at worst pleasantly tired.

Pete

 

[Web Monkey]

Actually two questions. First, for those of you that have mastered it, how long/how many dives did it take to perfect your bouyancy? Is the PADI Bouyancy class worth the money or can I just use the advice from the people on this board?

Bouyancy takes both practice and help from someone who knows what to look for (over or under-weighted/incorrect weight location/incorrect tank location/etc.)

Although a lot of people will tell you it gets better as you dive, it really only gets better if you change things that effect your buoyancy.

Any good diver should be able to help you with this, and most would be happy to if you ask.

As far as the class goes, I believe that making buoyancy a speciality is completely shameful. It would be like if you took a driving class and then found that you were driving into walls and they had a special "How to not drive into walls" class that they would sell you. They should have taught the required skills in your OW class.

Secondly, this is a what would you have done situation. I was recently diving a local lake with two people I met there. One recently certified, the other had been out of the sport for several years but and was just getting back into it. The first dive maxed at 71 ft, one diver got cold and we came up. We did not make a safety stop as we were only down for a few minutes. I did a solo dive at max 64 feet for 15 minutes, and then a hour and a half later we did another dive together where we maxed at 87 feet. We decided that on this last dive that we would do a safety stop. I hit the minimum air level first so we went up. As we got to about 20 feet I began to get neutral, however they shot up. I stayed at 15 feet for a few seconds, but I began to worry about the other two and decided to go up. After reaching the surface, I found them ok and they apologized for not being able to stop. About an hour later as I was driving home I got extremely fatigued. Luckily I was close to my house, so I made it there safely.

I know that I pushed my luck a little, but my concern was with the safety of my buddies. On the other side of the coin, I believe that every diver should look at their safety as their responsibility and only theirs. I am still obligated to make sure I get home to my wife at the end of the day.

Thoughts?

Your buddies need to be properly weighted and work on their buoyancy.

With less than 24 dives, you need to not be diving solo, and need to be doing significantly shallower dives. You haven't even begun to have an inkling of the number of ways things can go wrong, and do not have nearly the required knowledge or skill level to handle any sort of emergency at close to 90'

All three of you are lucky that you weren't injured, and I'd suggest practicing with more forgiving (shallower) dives, and making sure you do a safety stop after each one. It's not that you absolutely must do one, since technically it's optional, but the practice of holding a 3 minute stop @ 15' will be a great skill builder, and makes your average ascent rate significantly slower.

Terry

 

[Web Monkey]

Bouyancy takes both practice and help from someone who knows what to look for (over or under-weighted/incorrect weight location/incorrect tank location/etc.)

Although a lot of people will tell you it gets better as you dive, it really only gets better if you change things that effect your buoyancy.

Any good diver should be able to help you with this, and most would be happy to if you ask.

As far as the class goes, I believe that making buoyancy a speciality is completely shameful. It would be like if you took a driving class and then found that you were driving into walls and they had a special "How to not drive into walls" class that they would sell you. They should have taught the required skills in your OW class.


Your buddies need to be properly weighted and work on their buoyancy.

With less than 24 dives, you need to not be diving solo, and need to be doing significantly shallower dives. You haven't even begun to have an inkling of the number of ways things can go wrong, and do not have nearly the required knowledge or skill level to handle any sort of emergency at close to 90'

All three of you are lucky that you weren't injured, and I'd suggest practicing with more forgiving (shallower) dives, and making sure you do a safety stop after each one. It's not that you absolutely must do one, since technically it's optional, but the practice of holding a 3 minute stop @ 15' will be a great skill builder, and makes your average ascent rate significantly slower.

Terry

edit:

PS. Always stick with your buddy. When you end the dive, your buddy should end the dive.

 

[emcbride81]

Moving on to your second question...I don't think you should be diving solo with the limited number of dives you have, I would plan to do a safety stop on every dive, and if you were managing your air supply correctly you wouldn't have had to choose between a safety stop or running low on air.


It is a minor detail in the overall picture, but I wasn't low on air, we agreed that the first to 1000psi gave the "up" sign, which was me. I had plenty of air for the safety stop. The reason I went up was to make sure my buddies were ok. Having said that, this is why I posted the question here. The only way to gain wisdom is mentors and mistakes. I know I made some mistakes.

As for diving solo, very early on after my cert. my instructor let me go off on my own. I asked him if that was ok, cuz we were taught buddy always. He seemed like it didn't matter if I was aware of my depth and air at all times. So the first 4 dives I made after cert were all solo. I have made several more since then, none below 60 ft. I know my exp. is limited, but the strange part is I always felt like I was more aware of everything when I was alone...of course drunk drivers feel like they are more aware also...

 

[Jcsgt]

If you're instructor led you to believe it was no big deal, then he's irresponsible. No diver's ready to be solo right after certification.

 

[DeltaWardog]

Jeez. I would be terrified to go solo right now, having just completed my OW. I just wouldn't do it, it wouldn't be fun. I want an experienced DM no more than 10-15 ft away from me and my wife for our first few dives, and not too much further than that for my first dozen or two!