Dive boat operators face charges of illegally feeding sharks in state waters

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Are the record deaths from spinner sharks too?
We rarely have deaths due to shark attacks here in Florida. Not even one last year. Most of these are hit and run nips. When you bite something, expecting it to be yummy fish and it's yucky us instead, the reaction is immediate and unflattering. Most sharks simply gag and go the other way.

then they are out of place just like a bull shark near st pete in feb. The bulls leave when it gets cold, unless they have a damn good reason to stay.
My canoe was bumped by a bull shark just off of new Port Richey back in December of 1973. I remember that well. I also remember getting extremely sick off of the oysters we ate then too. Bulls are notorious for being where you don't expect them to be, including the rivers and lakes here in Florida.

Definitely bring your gun, hogfish ceviche is pretty much the best meal on earth.
Hoffish are God's gift to Spearos. :D
 
I was going to say, I hope the beer isn't trapped back in that fridge ...

I'm still reading up on the finds I've made; while I'm capable of demolishing a novel in two hours that doesn't necessarily translate to scientific literature. One thing I did find (I downloaded the .pdf somehow last night, but either I can't find the direct link or a paywall has gone up) was a comment on that study and a response from the authors. The comment did raise some questions about the methods; I'm rereading the paper, comments, and replies to see how those are addressed.

In the meantime, a few other finds:
PLOS ONE: Seasonal and Long-Term Changes in Relative Abundance of Bull Sharks from a Tourist Shark Feeding Site in Fiji
http://www.sfu.ca/biology/faculty/d...2007_Ecotourism effects on white sharks 1.pdf
http://www.austingallagher.com/files/Hammerschlag et al 2012.pdf
PLOS ONE: Opportunistic Visitors: Long-Term Behavioural Response of Bull Sharks to Food Provisioning in Fiji
PLOS ONE: Supplemental Feeding for Ecotourism Reverses Diel Activity and Alters Movement Patterns and Spatial Distribution of the Southern Stingray, Dasyatis americana
http://www.spc.int/DigitalLibrary/Doc/FAME/InfoBull/FishNews/133/FishNews133_40_Clua.pdf
PLOS ONE: Long-Term Changes in Species Composition and Relative Abundances of Sharks at a Provisioning Site

And, for perspective - PHD Comics: Science News Cycle

Thanks for these links Halcyon Daze.....In reading them, they bring up many more issues than I had considered before regarding the effects of different methods of feeding on the surrounding eco-system....Each tends to bring up more questions than it raises, but in regard to the present situation in Jupiter......Here we have several studies with long term monitoring, and NO sudden exploded mortality or ER visits in visiting divers--which speaks well to the beliefs on shark feeding shared with us by Randy and his buddies.

Moreover, there is a large body of research being done, with protocols we could easily borrow, and what was just posted here is showing some "holes" in what was researched, that we could help fill in with the Jupiter system.

Among the higher interest topics that jump out at me.....the effects on feeding on which certain species become more dominant in volume, versus the species which decline due to interspecies competition between them--that are essentially "forced out" of the area by the more dominant sharks ( what I would guess to be Bull sharks and Tiger Sharks.....this "could" suggest Randy may be able to alter the population dynamics and over time, gain many tiger sharks rather than just the single Tiger he now has.....and in addition to the positive eco-tourism effects this would have, it would create eco-system modifications such as predation on turtle species as this predation differs by shark species and it's volume in an area). It would also shift the prey species dynamics from the shark species that would be displaced by the larger more agressive sharks, the assumption being that some prey species would increase in populations, and others targeted by the dominant Bulls and Tigers, would diminish.

Little functional discussion of behavior to humans was developed in this collection of papers, but given the conspicuous absence of attack numbers, the assumption would be that the discussion of dangerous aggressive shark behavior from the feeds is still at a theoretical level, meaning it may take more than 10 years of heavy feeding for this to occur--or, it could mean that the current feeding tactics by the operators in the studies succeeded in preventing high frustration levels in sharks collecting for the feeds, or that the halting of feeds during the shark mating seasons may have helped to avoid the more aggressive behaviors causing catastrophic consequences for tourists.

Reading these papers has shifted my take on the shark feeds.....
I don't see Randy stopping the feeding in federal waters....the economic incentive is too high. There is no way to prevent Randy from doing this, and given the information I am now getting from these papers, I am not so sure I would want him to stop.
The research offers some very compelling directions for Palm Beach to take.
What I do see are some areas where researchers could work with Randy to assist in determining the best way to manage feeds and that result in the lowest frustration levels for the low pecking order sharks that show up....And the researchers may be able to help develop feeding plans for preventing the less dominant species from being displaced by the bulls and tigers. If this shows the actual population over the larger jupiter area would change radically, meaning suddenly we have a much larger population of bulls and tigers 4 years from now--then is this going to have an environmental effect of prey species that Palm Beach needs to be concerned about...

I think Randy has found a "money tree", I already created a massive bad will between he and myself, over his picking of this money tree due to the possible repercussions I was concerned with in shark behaviors to dive tourists----and I am not expecting this bad will to change much. On the other hand, the future is going to be "where the money is", so we might as well be constructive with what we have....

I am inclined to call for the PB County Dive Association and our connections with FAU and other marine scientists, to work toward a larger research project, that would embrace shark feeds and help make them less destructive to the ecosystem, and to mitigate the potential dangers to divers. Worst case scenario, standard dive gear 10 years from now might be divers carrying aroudn a 3 foot long pvc pipe, with go pro on it if they like....and when a shark comes in close to investigate, each diver has the required "tool" to safely keep away from the curious hands of the shark ( test biting equals curious hands).

I am not making an apology to Randy and his friends....I believe they are still changing shark behavior against the will of the majority. But there is not going to be any way to stop this, so I would prefer to end my war-like early response pattern, and I will now begin speaking more with marine scientists I know about studies that could make an uncomfortable situation, better.
 
I also have a suggestion for Emerald's operations, made with respect and no desire to put Randy out of business. Once you go north from Jupiter Inlet, the continental shelf extends outward, and there should be quite a few dive areas that are in (relatively) shallow water but also outside the 3 mile state limit. I know from my AOW trip that Randy, due to his spearfishing clientele, knows a lot of fishy spots that, because they are not so scenic, are not on the itenerary of the regular dive ops.

Shark feeds are a "portable" operation because, by definition, they attract sharks in. In fact, RAndy has moved his operations from hole in the wall to the Bonaire, which previously has had very few shark sightings.

My issue is with these feeds being put in popular dive areas like the Bonaire that are primarily visited by lots and lots of divers for other purposes (goliath spawns, photography, general sightseeing dives, classes, etc). Attracting and stimulating the big apex sharks adds another factor to these dives, constant vigiilance for shark approaches, that really is not fair for other divers.

I stand by my belief, based on experience and observation (and I am not the only experienced diver to concur), that these aggressive chuming/feeding/spearing shark attractions increase the hazard of these dives. Also, the studies seem to indicate an increased risk factor as well. Look also on the accidents and incidents forum for shark bites on feeding/chumming dives. They happen, we all know this.

No one can predict shark behavior, especialy when stimulated, with any reliability. Even on Abernethy's trips, with by far the longest record of observations, the #1 rule is NEVER TAKE YOUR EYES OFF THE APEX SHARKS, exactly due to this unpredictability factor.

While no one can (and never will) know precisely how much the risk is increased for other divers following on after the feeds, I do not want to become a human at-risk test subject in a "study" to determine "statistics" as to how risky these dives are by being subjected to the after-effects of these feeds at regular dive sites. Nor do I think the desires of a few should fairly be allowed to taint regular dive sites used by many others. It is, as others have said, a big ocean. And NetDoc, my analogy to conducting these feeds at Molasses and the Spiegel still stands.

So, my suggestion, respectfully made, is that these "portable" shark feeding operations be taken a few miles north away from regularly visited dive sites and developed at Randy's regular spearfishing sites (with abundant targets to spear and attract sharks) or other sites that he chooses to develop. I do believe that the risk at the regular dive sites is less, probably far less, when the stimulated sharks are miles away and may never visit the regular dive sites, or do so days after their artificial feeding stimulus and with no active stimulus present to re-trigger their behavior.

As for the safety of how the actual feeds are conducted, no secret there. But, I would not bar Randy from it, nor any person who wants to subject themselves and their families to the consequences. It is a free country after all (at least in federal waters--who says the U.S. gov't cannot do anything right!).

If they have consideration for the rest of us as to the regular, developed dive sites, I would accept them having their own suitably distant places as well, and I think I reflect the feelings of may others on this.
 
Some good suggestions in there - honestly, I would not be surprised if one of the university research labs in the area decides to look at this. UM, FIU, FAU, and NSU all have active shark research programs and this is a good, relevant topic to look into.

Just as I note - I wouldn't say the Zion Train or some of the other sites mentioned are normally shark-free. For a while the Zion Train was where Bimini Biological Field Station had its acoustic monitoring array for studying the lemon shark aggregations; last year was a bust for them but I presume they had reason to believe that was where they'd be hanging out. Governor's Riverwalk is another popular West Palm wreck site that can get sharky. Breakers is actually where I've seen a lot of tiger, hammerhead, and bull sightings reported for years; about 17 months ago I was there on a Sandy's Sunday trip and saw my first bull on a dive. If I'd been more alert or in a slightly different place I would have seen the bigger bull keeping station ahead of us and the 12-foot hammerhead that cruised through while I was distracted by a green turtle. I always assume the sharks are there; they just don't feel like introducing themselves without a good reason.
 
Wow, there's some turn about in this thread. I like that. I would like to see more of the industry lose that "If I don't dive, teach or sell it, then it must be crap!" attitude. I'm sure Randy's going to continue to operate his vessels in an appropriate manner. He's one of the more safety conscious captains I have ever met. I have never dove off of Calypso, so I have no idea how they conduct themselves, but I trust Randy to do the right thing.



Hammerhead tows Kayak
 
Halcyon,

I agree the sites are not shark-free, and I gladly visit them during the lemon migration and always look forward to seeing whatever unstimulated sharks are in the area. However, I am content if they do not introduce themselves looking for a handout, but only out of curiousity during their natural behavior. My main issue is that having artificially stimulated apex sharks (lemons, bulls, hammers, tigers) present on a regularly-visited advanced recreational site (100', currents, etc) requires constantly being on the lookout ("never take your eyes off the apex sharks!") and detracts from enjoyment of the site for non-shark focused divers (and adds another task to the load and a possible startle factor for less experienced divers). This is especially true when this site is a keystone of the goliath aggregation and divers go for that, not for sharks.

I do not view unstimulated shark sightings even of apex sharks with anywhere near the same level of concern. I consider those a thrill, not a risk, due to sharks' natural stand-offishness from scuba divers.

My comment was in general, the zion area is where I have seen the fewest sharks (have had much more sightings elsewhere), more to show that if Randy can draw sharks there, it would be practical and very do-able for the Emerald to develop other more remote sites for the feeds. Then, for those divers looking to concentrate of shark sightings, they have their dedicated places.

Ever since my first (and only) great hammerhead swim-by, thirty years ago, I have been looking foward to another sighting. No luck yet. Maybe I should take more trips to (a feed-free?) Breakers . . .
 
We rarely have deaths due to shark attacks here in Florida. Not even one last year. Most of these are hit and run nips. When you bite something, expecting it to be yummy fish and it's yucky us instead, the reaction is immediate and unflattering. Most sharks simply gag and go the other way.

My canoe was bumped by a bull shark just off of new Port Richey back in December of 1973. I remember that well. I also remember getting extremely sick off of the oysters we ate then too. Bulls are notorious for being where you don't expect them to be, including the rivers and lakes here in Florida.


Very few deaths but still the most. I'm worried about changing the behavior of a region's apex predators more than diver safety anyway.

On your bull shark experience... December is different than February and I'm skeptical of your certainty in identifying it while in canoeing depths 40 years ago.:idk:

Could it have happened? Sure but just like great whites in the keys in June, it's abnormal.

After reading those studies I'm gonna climb down off my soapbox. ..for now. I think a local study of this action with these sharks is what we need. Until that happens the science says it's OK so I'm not gonna argue anymore... Today.
 
Looks like they are not going to stop bringing the feeding circus to the Bonaire site.

Unfortunately, it looks like divers who enjoy these sites will need to make the effort to shut down this operation.
 
Guy, as discussed earlier the Bonaire is in federal waters, 3.54 nmi out going by Force-E's coordinates and Google Earth. FWC does not have jurisdiction out there. As far as the risk, lately I've been reviewing YouTube clips to try and figure when my best shot at seeing hammerheads is. Randy's been shark diving at that spot for at least a year. As stated, I've been diving there in that timeframe with and without bait and the sharks have been hit and miss (mostly miss for me). Mickey's latest clip even shows fish being lift-bagged off the bottom without getting rushed, even with multiple tigers and hammerheads around. It's something to monitor, but I'm not seeing reason to worry about diving the site when Randy's not doing a feed.
 
Looks like they are not going to stop bringing the feeding circus to the Bonaire site.

Unfortunately, it looks like divers who enjoy these sites will need to make the effort to shut down this operation.
Well, there is always the option of getting a 3rd buddy to "Ride Shotgun" with you guys for the dive :) Just kidding :) Sort of :) ( this could just mean a buddy with a big PVC pipe that is happy to be the "Interventionist", if any of the sharks get too frisky.

"Interventionist"....it could become a new PADI Specialty, and some divers could dive for Free with this cert!!!
 
https://xf2.scubaboard.com/community/forums/cave-diving.45/

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