Does this make sense to any of you?

[MXGratefulDiver]

Now that's hilarious. Especially when it's coming from an SDI Instructor.

I'm a NAUI instructor ...

There are only two places most divers (especially new one's) solve problems. On the surface and on the bottom. Trying to regain composure on a wall is a tad bit stressful for new divers. If you have zero life's experience, any situation at depth has a great potential of ending up poorly.

Now you seem to be agreeing with what I said ...

Everything is much more colorful when you're shallow and there is a lot more reef life. Not only that, but your air will last longer. If you want to dive deep, go for it as an adult.

These are all good things to tell someone who's a new diver. Lots of newer divers get obsessed with depth ... bagging that "100 foot dive" seems to be a goal unto itself. However, few are aware of how to properly prepare for that sort of dive. Some get themselves in real trouble because of it.

Kids don't take that option. They will go where their parents go, because they trust them to keep them out of trouble.:no

That applies to instructors as well as parents ... and adult students as well as kids. New divers tend to put more trust than they should in the more experienced diver to keep them from harm ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[Walter]

New divers tend to put more trust than they should in the more experienced diver to keep them from harm ...

Especially Instructors. Divers need to rely more on their own abilities.

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

Especially Instructors. Divers need to rely more on their own abilities.

Agreed ... but first they must have some abilities to rely on. That takes bottom time, regardless of how good the academic and confined parts of the OW class might be ... which is why it's just a bad idea to take new divers deep. The deeper you take them, the more the dive becomes a "trust me" experience ... they simply don't have the context yet upon which to base any judgment of their own abilities ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[Papa_Bear]

Can someone show me where the bodies are piling up? I am the last one to encourage deep diving, but I encourage good instruction, and not judging what isn't a problem! I have been to GC many times and 100ft at Orange Canyon is not near the same as 100 ft at Bird Rock at Catalina Calif! I read it as it was an optional explorer dive after certification! And the word "Children" what does that mean? To some here 41 is a child! Your Growth plates are active to 25 so now what? It is everything in moderation as my Grandmother used to say! A swim past 96ft is not the same in warm clear water as a task dive to 96ft in cold, limited viz, and high current water! If you have been there and done that maybe you would understand a little better, but we have a bunch of negative nabobs judging a fellow instructor who has an acceptable safety record to what end? Another thing someone else wants to control or regulate?

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

Can someone show me where the bodies are piling up?

I've personally known two people who died primarily because they decided to go deeper than they were qualified to go, and when something went wrong they were unable to deal with it successfully.

Now, that may not constitute a pile ... but those weren't just faceless statistics. They were real people who I knew, met at dive sites, and cared about.

Had they not been so focused on depth ... had they chosen instead to keep their diving within the limits of their training and experience ... I'd most likely still be meeting and talking to them at dive sites.

I am unashamed to admit that those two people's deaths have an influence on my views on this subject ... in one of those two cases, the diver's decision to trust his dive instructor had everything to do with putting himself in a place to die ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[MHK]

This entire thread is based on the premise that a newspaper article is accurate.
Fat chance.

I regularly discount media reports as a matter of course, however in the instant case the reporter was directly involved with the dive, not merely reporting on an event that he had not been involved in. He made a rather declarative statement speaking to the issue of showing his SPG and making note of the specific depth, along with a comment about the kids being OK at that depth. While there is a possibility he has his facts wrong, I'm less inclined to suspect a factual error given the personal nature of the involvement of the author.

Once again, the larger point that sadened me about this article is the relative lack of awareness respecting risk management and, what appears to me, as a lack of appreciation for rigid training. The "diving is fun and easy to learn" storyline is what debases the value of education.

Regards,

 

[Web Monkey]

Can someone show me where the bodies are piling up?

People are sturdier than they look, so the bodies aren't piling up very fast. However the permanent injuries and piles of never-to-be-used-again SCUBA equipment are everywhere.

Terry

 

[Thalassamania]

Can someone show me where the bodies are piling up? I am the last one to encourage deep diving, but I encourage good instruction, and not judging what isn't a problem! I have been to GC many times and 100ft at Orange Canyon is not near the same as 100 ft at Bird Rock at Catalina Calif! I read it as it was an optional explorer dive after certification! And the word "Children" what does that mean? To some here 41 is a child! Your Growth plates are active to 25 so now what? It is everything in moderation as my Grandmother used to say! A swim past 96ft is not the same in warm clear water as a task dive to 96ft in cold, limited viz, and high current water! If you have been there and done that maybe you would understand a little better, but we have a bunch of negative nabobs judging a fellow instructor who has an acceptable safety record to what end? Another thing someone else wants to control or regulate?

You are, once again, wasting everyone's time pontificating without supplying data and analysis, or rational criticism of existing data and analysis.

Do some work for a change. Put out some effort beyond your delight in polemics. Go get the UHMS and agency publications, read them, reach a conclusion based on something other than anecdotal experience. Then argue the case on it's merits.

 

[sweatfrog]

I'm a NAUI instructor ...

Your profile lists SDI/TDI as well.

Now you seem to be agreeing with what I said ...

Everythings not always black and white. Every recreational agency (including NAUI) has it's good and bad points. I don't agree with everything PADI does, as I'm sure you don't agree with everything NAUI does. That doesn't give you the right to trash an agency. :no

I have seen people who don't follow standards and no matter which agency, they won't be around long.

 

[Rick Murchison]

... get the UHMS and agency publications, read them, reach a conclusion based on something other than anecdotal experience. Then argue the case on it's merits.

Come now Thass... this is the internet! Get with the program... no homework, no exams
Rick