Suit filed in case of "Girl dead, boy injured at Glacier National Park

[rmorgan]

her obituary seems to imply she was a more experienced diver than the Complaint does.

I read—certified in NC at 15, a dive on GBR at 16, then the horror at 18. Seems consistent to me, fwiw.

 

[texspeleo]

Almost all of the very grievous errors she made had almost nothing to do with diving or instructional skill. She could have been the greatest thing they had ever seen at the ICD and IE. The violations are all conscious decisions.

If a root cause analysis was performed, I’m fairly certain that instructional quality would be an elemental factor.

 

[boulderjohn]

If a root cause analysis was performed, I’m fairly certain that instructional quality would be an elemental factor.

Perhaps, but we cannot tell much about her instructional skill since we never see her use it, except on that first dive with E.G., which was certainly an abomination.

Back up far enough in this thread, and we see a contradiction. The complaint said that the dive in which she died was "noninstructional," but someone quoted the attorney (David Concannon) saying that the dive WAS instructional. That contradiction will have to be cleared up if we are to make any sense of it all. There was certainly no attempt at any sort of instruction on the dive.

 

[rmorgan]

boulderjohn, I agree the Hubbell situation seems not especially relevant as to PADI. But at the same time, I’d expect a dive op that had a rental customer die, apparently after 25 years without a dive and no refresher dive or assessment, would prompt a very close review by a responsible operator. As to PADI, well, my wife just got her AOW based in part on “fish identification” because that’s what the operator offered. She’s a capable and careful diver, so we didn’t much mind, but still...

 

[Wookie]

The story gives information about the Hubbell case which we were otherwise unable to discover.

Last July, according to records, Ellen Hubbell sued Gull Dive in the death of her husband Jesse who drowned in Canyon Ferry in June 2019. Jesse hadn’t scuba dived in more than 25 years so he wasn’t certified, but Gull Dive still rented equipment to him and it was later found Hubbell’s regulator was on backward.​

The complaint said he was not certified, but this article said he had not dived "in more than 25 years so he wasn’t certified." The reporter likely did not know that certifications do not expire. If he was certified 25 years ago, then he was certified when he rented the equipment and when he dived. Perhaps he was not certified 25 years ago. I do not know what it means that a regulator was on backward. It is possible that the tank was set up with the valve on the back rather than toward the head, but in that case the regulator would work.

The Hubbell case is still ongoing but hadn’t gotten far by the time Linnea started interacting with Gull Dive. But there was no way for students like Linnea to know about the Hubbell case because Gull Dive didn’t report it to PADI in 2019 and kept using the PADI name.
​

This, too, contradicts the complaint, which faults PADI for not dealing with the dive shop over the Hubbell case.

PADI did expel Gull Dive following the Hubbell case. They removed all PADI logos from their website and store, but the website wording wasn’t changed, indicating that they still offered PADI courses. Linnea was given an actual Adventures in Diving crew pack (I didn’t know you could still buy crew packs) and she had done “some” knowledge reviews.

I haven’t taught an advanced class in 20 years, and I may have only done one in my life. Is Drysuit an adventure dive for Advanced, and is it a chapter in the Adventures in Diving paper manual?

 

[Bob DBF]

The complaint said he was not certified, but this article said he had not dived "in more than 25 years so he wasn’t certified." The reporter likely did not know that certifications do not expire. If he was certified 25 years ago, then he was certified when he rented the equipment and when he dived. Perhaps he was not certified 25 years ago. I do not know what it means that a regulator was on backward. It is possible that the tank was set up with the valve on the back rather than toward the head, but in that case the regulator would work.

He may not have been certified at all, depending on when he started diving rather than when he quit. I could have continued diving without a cert for some time after I did get certified if I wanted to dive locally because everyone knew I was a diver and could get my tanks filled. I wanted to travel and dive so I needed a card for ops I didn't know, and got one. That's in Ca, Montana is probably more lenient.

As far as the reg being on backwards, think tank 180 degrees from normal. Other than being a weird hose routing, it will work.

 

[MrVegas]

Is Drysuit an adventure dive for Advanced, and is it a chapter in the Adventures in Diving paper manual?

I have my AOW book and there is a Drysuit Adventure Dive chapter, with a knowledge review that the student is supposed to sign off on The book, though, is title "Advanced Open Water Diver" so maybe that is different from "Adventures in Diving."

 

[Wookie]

Other than being a weird hose routing, it will work.

Meh. Turn a mark 10, 11, 15, 17, or 20 with the reg barrel up and the hoses may be a little short but still in close to the right spots.

 

[Wookie]

I have my AOW book and there is a Drysuit Adventure Dive chapter, with a knowledge review that the student is supposed to sign off on The book, though, is title "Advanced Open Water Diver" so maybe that is different from "Adventures in Diving."

Nope, that’s what I needed to know....

Calling it Adventures in diving shows my age.

 

[MrVegas]

Nope, that’s what I needed to know....

My book is the 2016 edition. "Dry Suit Diving" starts on page 196.