Should I have done more?

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I must say that from what i read and what i saw in the video it looked way better than you described (maybe it's a had to be there thing)... There are some things i think you could've done differently yes, or rather things I would've and have done differently in similar situations.

1. I would've attempted to "calm" her down at depth first before attempting any surfacing, even in calling a dive i think it's much easier if the person was as calm as possible given the scenario... a moment or two at the bottom just breathing to calm the nerves.

2. I wouldn't have dove with the speargun (the camera is not in your hand and is fine), there was a couple of times i was diving with my instructor and he would be diving with students and other certified but not experienced divers. I would not unclip my camera (or leave it on the boat altogether) until i see how the other divers are doing in the water. You said you would look after her and i think having a reel and the gun is already enough to be concerned about

3. From the video things didn't happen in a flash, it looked as if you had enough time to move over to her and pull her dump valve etc or at the very least make yourself negative an hold on to her


i think that's all that i would've done differently
 
....In my defense,....

You asked the question, so here is my answer. This dive was a CF from the start. You acknowledge she seemed nervous from the git go and her experience was “pretty thin”. That should have been clue number one not to do the dive. You did anyway, had it been me, considering one of the buddies “seemed” nervous (and questionable experience) I would have, at a minimum left the gun on the boat knowing a nervous buddy needs a bit more attention. You dive to the ability of the least experienced diver and would it kill you just to have a “fun dive”.
Now you are in the water, video clearly shows she has no buoyancy control and is not comfortable in the water and never stops kicking, even at the bottom. Add to that she is obviously having issues with her mask or is becoming way too focused on her mask, another sign of nervousness/task loading. You compound this problem by allowing your son (and dive buddy) to ascend alone after giving you a sign that he is having problems (you assume an ear issue). You should have gathered everyone up and ascended with him. There are a whole lot of “good divers” that become statistics. How many times have we all read the lines “he seemed ok when I left him…”. Worse yet, you make a very bad assumption that he is with the flag on the way up. He could be a 50 yards from the flag upon surfacing in a high boat traffic area alone, not a good place to be, especially if this “little problem” escalated into a bigger problem. Or your assumption that it was an ear issue was wrong and he was trying to signal that he had vertigo…..not a good way to surface alone. I seem to remember another video you posted where your son is trying to signal you and you never quite get what he is telling you? Again, at the point your son signals you, you already can see she is not doing well, why push on?
Now you are on the bottom, some significant buddy separation with a buddy that is exhibiting obvious stress, and you turn to tie in the flag. Watch the video, your focus for 15 seconds is not on her. See how fast she took off at 20’, think of where she would be if she bolted as you turned to hook in?
Now you are surfacing, which I applaud you for, you finally realize that this dive is over, but at that point, at 20 feet she just gets away from you. As you stated “you should have been in her face” because you knew she was having problems, and you are correct, you should have been in touch contact since she never had proper buoyancy control from the beginning, she was nervous and limited experience.
As for feeling guilty if she had embolized, well, the problems started on the boat before the dive, the rapid ascent was merely the end result of bad decisions throughout the dive.
 
Wow.. At least you know the local conditions.. With all the shark feeding on the local wrecks.. I'll be damned if I am not diving with something to poke them with. Seriously. Also, I am so used to carrying a gun, it would seem weird without it.

As for my son, we agree, I should have communicated better and watched him, but if you look at the video.. he signaled me from the surface.(t = 0:36).. I admit I was task loaded with the other buddy. On the other hand, he does have two scuba tanks on and can freedive to the bottom in this depth. :coffee:

As for turning my back to hook off, again I pointed that out as unwise, but at the time, she had (finally) cleared her mask and I figured we would get her buoyancy resolved next.. but the current was dragging us away from the wreck (and the drop was not ahead of the wreck as it should have been)...so it was basically hook off now or the dive is probably screwed.. because we would be blown off. The current was stronger on the surface and was pulling on the float. Managing a float/reel in a current does present some difficulties.

I don't want to sound too defensive, because it is obvious to me that I should have been able to predict and manage things a little better.
 
You asked the question, so here is my answer. This dive was a CF from the start. You acknowledge she seemed nervous from the git go and her experience was “pretty thin”. That should have been clue number one not to do the dive. .

That principle would preclude most buddy dives with inexperienced divers. Lots of novice divers with pretty thin experience may be a bit nervous before the dive and then be fine once in the water.


Sent from my XT905 using Tapatalk
 
That principle would preclude most buddy dives with inexperienced divers. Lots of novice divers with pretty thin experience may be a bit nervous before the dive and then be fine once in the water.

Then you take them in in appropriate conditions first and work up to the ones that might make them nervous.

Sometimes not getting in the water is the answer.
 
That principle would preclude most buddy dives with inexperienced divers. Lots of novice divers with pretty thin experience may be a bit nervous before the dive and then be fine once in the water.


Sent from my XT905 using Tapatalk

Lots of fun dives for novice divers shallower than 80', especially in the area they were diving. You would be amazed at how much fun a new diver can have on a shallow reef or a chunk of wreck in 40' of water.

But you need to change the attitude of "we are diving here and you are following" to "what is the best dive for the experience level of the least experienced diver".
 
Hi Dumpster,

Disclaimer: I am not a DM, instructor, or Tech certified--just a recreational diver. Please accept my comments while understanding that I have no business critiquing this incident.

After reading your OP without watching the vid, I thought I was going to witness an underwater disaster while watching the vid. While you probably could have done some things differently, and will next time---thankfully, nobody got injured.

After watching your vid, my impression of this lady's diving ability was that she is a dependent diver. She has obviously dived before, but seemed to be expecting more care and direction from her buddy (you).

I did cringe when your son went to the surface and you had to stay with the free falling (dependent?) diver. Thankfully, you trained him well (my assumption) and he was OK.

Having worked on the Ocean professionally, and found myself in many new-to-me situations that could have turned out badly, I have learned to never beat-myself-up over incidents that turned out OK. Learn from them and keep trying to cover all contingencies in the future.

markm
 
As others have noticed, the video doesn't look as bad as your OP might suggest. I'll go as far as to say she doesn't look or act as stressed as was indicated although she was obviously stressed enough to abort the dive.

Other than juggling all the gear, spear gun, etc. the main thing this dive demonstrates (to me anyway) is just what can commonly be expected if you take an unknown diver who clearly had equipment issues on most any dive.

I've been on dives like that but I mainly avoid them. If they go well it's just luck. The only "problem" is promising to "keep an eye" on another diver that you can't really have much control over if you don't know anything about that diver.
 
Lots of fun dives for novice divers shallower than 80', especially in the area they were diving. You would be amazed at how much fun a new diver can have on a shallow reef or a chunk of wreck in 40' of water.

But you need to change the attitude of "we are diving here and you are following" to "what is the best dive for the experience level of the least experienced diver".
I'm sure that's right, but this diver knew they were going to 80' and wanted to do the dive. Presumably she was certified to dive to that depth. It seems that her problem was mask flooding, equipment issues and very poor buoyancy control (possibly due to over weighing ), rather than depth. I think that it would be unfortunate if experienced divers were to refuse to do a dive to 80' with an inexperienced diver who looked nervous.

To put it in context, I'm about to hit 100 dives and I still get a bit nervous before each dive. I've had that since day 1. The nervousness disappears as soon as I descend. Doing an 80' dive has never been a problem (since AOW deep dive). It would be a shame if experienced divers would refuse to buddy with me on deeper dives just because I looked nervous.

DD didn't push her into the dive and could not have foreseen the mask troubles and buoyancy issues. At least she had a buddy who was able to handle the situation and help her, to a better level than most buddies would.
 
when i was doing my DM i was actively thinking to myself i don't want anyone to die on my watch but i won't put myself in a life threatening position either. in this example, i would have tried to calm the person but if they bolt for the surface and i can't stop them i'm not coming after them. there is no point reason to have two people in a critical condition when 1 will suffice. just look at what happened in malta recently with the english guy.


out of curiosity, what were you going to spear?
 
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