SuperMiguel
Contributor
So whats the best BP, harness and Wing for doubles LP 108
Best BP/W for doubles? LP108
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I use a halcyon ss plate with halcyon harness and 60lbs wing.
I don't think the brand name of the backplate is as important as the material...although I use a Halcyon as well. LP108s are heavy tanks, and you may want to look at an aluminum backplate because of this. If you have the opportunity to try some backplates, that would be the best way to find one that works for you.
As for the wing, 60lbs should be about right, I prefer the donut style wings, but I think this is a preference.
The harness is probably a little less important than the backplate and wing, simply because it is cheap to replace when needed. However, getting some good quality webbing should last a few years.
As for the wing, 60lbs should be about right, I prefer the donut style wings, but I think this is a preference.
The harness is probably a little less important than the backplate and wing, simply because it is cheap to replace when needed. However, getting some good quality webbing should last a few years.
cool_hardware52
Contributor
Wing capacity is largely a function of the buoyancy of the divers exposure suit. 108's are not particularly heavy tanks ~-1 lbs each empty.
Tobin
There is no "best". A lot depends on where you are diving and how 108s fit on you and how they balance.
As Tobin points out, they aren't terribly negative when empty, so if you are diving cold water, the decision between steel and aluminum plate will be made more on where you need to PUT weight than it will be on managing total ballast. On the other hand, in warm water with minimal exposure protection, you might not even want the weight of a steel plate. You'll be starting the dive around 20 lbs negative from gas.
So material is situation-dependent. Brand is personal preference. There are several brands of plate made from good quality materials and with good workmanship. They have different small features, like the lower corner bend and ability to use the Cinch on the Halcyon, or the weight plate holes in the DSS (not relevant to doubles). Some have camband slots for single tanks and others don't; some have multiple holes for bolts on doubles and others don't.
With wings, you first have to decide the total lift you need, which needs to do two things -- float the rig with you out of it, and compensate for the buoyancy loss possible from your exposure protection. It's a hazard to buy too little lift, and a nuisance to have a wing that's too big. (Bungies don't solve that!) In addition, how the tanks balance for you can argue for one wing over another -- For example, I like the Deep Outdoors wings because they have a very large upper arc to park gas in to battle the head-heaviness of doubles, since I don't have any legs to speak of to get my Jet fins out behind me as a counterweight. (Those wings are no longer available, and I just mention them as an example.) Wings also vary in the size and material of the corrugated hose, and how rapidly the inflator will fill the wing, among other things.
There is no "best". There may be a "best for you and your diving environment," but we'd need a lot more information to be able to advise about that.
Although you didn't ask for it, I am also going to offer that, having been certified just a couple of months ago, you might do well to spend some solid time in a single tank setup and develop a really stable platform before perturbing it with doubles. If you are frustrated by short dives, the solution is better gas consumption and not double tanks.
As Tobin points out, they aren't terribly negative when empty, so if you are diving cold water, the decision between steel and aluminum plate will be made more on where you need to PUT weight than it will be on managing total ballast. On the other hand, in warm water with minimal exposure protection, you might not even want the weight of a steel plate. You'll be starting the dive around 20 lbs negative from gas.
So material is situation-dependent. Brand is personal preference. There are several brands of plate made from good quality materials and with good workmanship. They have different small features, like the lower corner bend and ability to use the Cinch on the Halcyon, or the weight plate holes in the DSS (not relevant to doubles). Some have camband slots for single tanks and others don't; some have multiple holes for bolts on doubles and others don't.
With wings, you first have to decide the total lift you need, which needs to do two things -- float the rig with you out of it, and compensate for the buoyancy loss possible from your exposure protection. It's a hazard to buy too little lift, and a nuisance to have a wing that's too big. (Bungies don't solve that!) In addition, how the tanks balance for you can argue for one wing over another -- For example, I like the Deep Outdoors wings because they have a very large upper arc to park gas in to battle the head-heaviness of doubles, since I don't have any legs to speak of to get my Jet fins out behind me as a counterweight. (Those wings are no longer available, and I just mention them as an example.) Wings also vary in the size and material of the corrugated hose, and how rapidly the inflator will fill the wing, among other things.
There is no "best". There may be a "best for you and your diving environment," but we'd need a lot more information to be able to advise about that.
Although you didn't ask for it, I am also going to offer that, having been certified just a couple of months ago, you might do well to spend some solid time in a single tank setup and develop a really stable platform before perturbing it with doubles. If you are frustrated by short dives, the solution is better gas consumption and not double tanks.
OP
SuperMiguel
Contributor
Thanks for all the help, the only reason i wanted to go to doubles is because i wanted to take the advance recreational trimax and double its required by my shop
I understand the requirements for doubles for such a class. I ask again, have you done all the good diving there is to do with the certification you have? Are your skills really up to doing the dives that advanced recreational trimix is required for? (I'm not being nasty -- for all I know you have been diving every single day since your certification. I just see an awful lot of people going MUCH too fast in this sport.)
OP
SuperMiguel
Contributor
agree with you and agree in both points, I just got certified 2 months ago, i did my open water, then my advance open water and this weekend i did my deep specialization... and i felt good in the water and was able to do the skills without much problems but i wont be taking my ART class for a while, but i want to get ready for it.. Buying doubles and the equipment around it its expensive, and i want to start buying things here and there that way i have a better chance of picking up deals like the wings from this guys: Clearance : Dive Addicts Inc
One thing i hate is buying something that i cant try and wont know how different it is from something else... like backplates there are tons of them just not sure how to shop for one.. same with the wings not sure how big of a wing i need... Kinda the same thing with tanks.. I got few lp95s and many people tell me they are horrible for doubles, few tell me that they are the ****! for doubles... and testing it will cost me a bit because of the hardware requirements... etc etc
One thing i hate is buying something that i cant try and wont know how different it is from something else... like backplates there are tons of them just not sure how to shop for one.. same with the wings not sure how big of a wing i need... Kinda the same thing with tanks.. I got few lp95s and many people tell me they are horrible for doubles, few tell me that they are the ****! for doubles... and testing it will cost me a bit because of the hardware requirements... etc etc
Well, I can't off the top of my head think of anything in diving on which there is unanimity. As we recently demonstrated, we can even fight over whether it's a good idea to plan ahead to have enough gas for a dive!
With wings, you are going to need different ones for different situations. Single tanks and doubles need different wings. Small doubles need different wings than big ones, or if you decide to carry stages and deco bottles. There is no way to make one purchase and cover all bases. The more specific your question, the closer you can get to consensus on advice -- but there will still be dissenting voices.
BTW, I believe you are SoCal -- if you want some good advice about putting together the type of equipment you are looking at, you have a lot of resources. Talk to Tobin George at Deep Sea Supply. He's very helpful. You might also talk to somebody like Steve Millington, one of the LA GUE instructors. GUE Primer is also an excellent class on how to develop that stable platform in the water that I was talking about, and you can do that in a single tank.
With wings, you are going to need different ones for different situations. Single tanks and doubles need different wings. Small doubles need different wings than big ones, or if you decide to carry stages and deco bottles. There is no way to make one purchase and cover all bases. The more specific your question, the closer you can get to consensus on advice -- but there will still be dissenting voices.
BTW, I believe you are SoCal -- if you want some good advice about putting together the type of equipment you are looking at, you have a lot of resources. Talk to Tobin George at Deep Sea Supply. He's very helpful. You might also talk to somebody like Steve Millington, one of the LA GUE instructors. GUE Primer is also an excellent class on how to develop that stable platform in the water that I was talking about, and you can do that in a single tank.
OP
SuperMiguel
Contributor
Nah im in South Florida... ya i get what you are saying, and i dont even know if ill like all this tec diving and cave diving... But unfortunately i think ill need to spend some money to figure out... at this point im not sure on what i need and i think im trying to get a "get one fit all" type of answer.. or at least something that will get me trough to training... Ill be using double LP95 or LP 108 and i think for the classes i do need a deco bottle.. Since its winter ill probably be using a 7mm... Dive addicts have a great sale on Hollis wings $129 for a 60# wing... would something like that work for my needs at least for now until i figure out exactly what i need... And well after all its only $129...
Im pretty sure the BP will be standard for all my needs, also the harness probably would be standard so the only variable is the Wing..
Im pretty sure the BP will be standard for all my needs, also the harness probably would be standard so the only variable is the Wing..
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