Cozumel Incident 9/4/11

[ianr33]

I believe I have a good understanding.

Was replying to rchandler,not you Don

 

[Jax]

I've been following these threads with great interest, and a whole lot of :w-t-f:.

Really? A bounce dive to <whatever> feet is bragging rights? :w-t-f:

That's like bragging, "I jumped off the Golden Gate bridge." . . .

And to think others might actually be impressed such an action . . . really?

 

[rhwestfall]

And to think others might actually be impressed such an action . . . really?

only those of like minds.....

 

[scubawife]

I am curious how "many people" could know the details of the planned dive and actual events. One of the injured stated in another thread that a downcurrent forced them lower than planned...yet several pages back, someone stated that a downcurrent was not a factor.

How many know the actual, real story directly from one of the victims, or how many have had events relayed to them from someone who was told by someone was told by someone who heard it directly? I would guess that like any serious situation, the details get around and along the way, there are omissions, additions and changes.

I'm sure there is truth in what reputable sources are saying, but the only way to know what really happened is to hear it directly from someone involved. Even then, each of them will have their version based on their experience and perspective.

What I've taken from the bits and pieces, and between the lines, of what's been posted is that IF there was a down current, to get pushed to 300ft you'd have to have been pretty deep to start with. If to reach the surface they had to do a controlled emergency ascent, all buddy breathing off one tank, then I interpret that to mean they didn't have enough air to deal with an emergency at their planned depth, whatever that depth was.

The other thing is that if there is no dive accident coverage for dm's in Cozumel, and if there are a lot of dive professionals there who are totally uninsured, not even having basic medical coverage, that's a really scary thing. They all pay dues to various agencies and associations to keep their professional affiliations, both as individuals and their businesses. This is something that those organizations should be getting behind them and fighting for. I cannot imagine doing something with so much risk on a daily basis, knowing that if something went wrong, I'd be financially screwed, or maybe even denied care if I couldn't pay for it.

 

[driftin' by]

Dandy Don said: "I cannot discuss secrets sent in PMs or gleaned from between the line reading, sorry."

Well if Dandy Don ain't talkin' ......
Maybe somebody could send these top secret PMs over to Wikileaks.

Yeah, like your IP address is hidden and/or untraceable! I don't know... when words like liable, slanderous and defamation of character come to my mind, I tend to shy away for sharing such information. Secrets, promises or private messages, it's not my place to share what I may or may not know. YMMV.

I would guess that like any serious situation, the details get around and along the way, there are omissions, additions and changes.

It was called the post-office game when I was a wee-tot.

 

[cruiser]

Bounce dive to 300 fsw. Max depth 350+ for Gabi & Opal. 21% back gas. Single tank each. No deco bottles or support divers. No technical training. I'm guessing that the tanks are either AL80 or AL100 as ScubaMau did not have steel tanks, or that is the answer I got when I inquired when I last dove with them. No, there was no so-called down-current. It played no role in this incident.

I don't dive this deep so have to ask this question. Is the above dive plan by itself enough to run out of air? Or did something else have to happen to cause the OOA situation?

 

[WSOPFAN]

What I've taken from the bits and pieces, and between the lines, of what's been posted is that IF there was a down current, to get pushed to 300ft you'd have to have been pretty deep to start with.

Totally agree.......

The other thing is that if there is no dive accident coverage for dm's in Cozumel, and if there are a lot of dive professionals there who are totally uninsured, not even having basic medical coverage, that's a really scary thing. They all pay dues to various agencies and associations to keep their professional affiliations, both as individuals and their businesses. This is something that those organizations should be getting behind them and fighting for. I cannot imagine doing something with so much risk on a daily basis, knowing that if something went wrong, I'd be financially screwed, or maybe even denied care if I couldn't pay for it.

Excellent points.....

 

[cenotist]

Is the above dive plan by itself enough to run out of air? Or did something else have to happen to cause the OOA situation?

See message #133. Short answer: In a "perfect world", yes. In a real world you can see yourself...

 

[ianr33]

I don't dive this deep so have to ask this question. Is the above dive plan by itself enough to run out of air? Or did something else have to happen to cause the OOA situation?

With a decent SAC rate the numbers allow a bounce to 300 feet on an 80, but there is no room whatsoever for error.

Higher SAC than expected,a minutes delay on the bottom,not stopping quickly enough at 300,too slow on the descent,too slow on the ascent, pretty much anything not just right and you're screwed.

To put some numbers on it,one extra minute on the bottom works out to around an extra 700 psi being used!

 

[Tesibria]

...The other thing is that if there is no dive accident coverage for dm's in Cozumel....

I think that over at http://www.scubaboard.com/forums/cozumel/395669-thread-split-dan-insurance-cozumel-dms.html it's been determined -- from both direct contact with DAN and review of DAN documents -- that such coverage *is* available. However, the medical coverage for dive accidents is very very low -- only $5K for any incident occurring in Mexico.