Diver dead on the Andrea Doria

[Thalassamania]

Buying it wouldn't be very impressive though.

Karma.

 

[Crush]

I don't think diving is considered "very dangerous". But deep technical diving is riskier than shallow reef diving, and wreck penetration is riskier yet. People who do these dives have usually done a lot of diving and a great deal of training to be prepared for the things that can go wrong. Yet, as the recent WKPP death proved, humans can and will make mistakes -- and the ocean environment is a dynamic thing, and aging wrecks are potentially unstable, and there are some situations where no amount of training or preparation will salvage the situation. People who do such dives are aware of the issues, and have done their own risk/benefit assessment and concluded the dive is worth it. I don't know that any of us would do a dive if we were told we WOULD die doing it, but all of us who do the riskier dives inspect the odds and accept them. Every once in a while, the chamber holds a live round.

TSandM, to put this is perspective, it might be useful to point out that in the bad 'ol days there was a rash of open water scuba diving instructors who were dying in caves. Undoubtedly their third to last thought was: "I have been an instructor for X years and there is no reason why I need extra training from NACD (or whomever else) to enter those caves," their second to last thought was "that's not too good," and their last thought was "Oh, sh!t." You don't have to be a rocket scientist or an Olympian to dive a wreck, but if you haven't received proper training you can't ascertain your ability to survive in an overhead environment (granted, caves and wrecks each pose unique hazards) if things start to go askew.

 

[Centrals]

TSandM: the wkpp incident was interesting but do we know what rebreather the diver was using. From my understanding the wkpp rebreather doesn't monitor po2... Is that right? Pscr? I don't think we can compare the two incidents at this point until we know what rebreather was being used. Maybe I'm way off but an O2 sensor would seem to have saved the Wkp guy.
So you know I don't dive rebreathers but would like to know if or why I am wrong on this.

Do you know the differences between SCR(semi-close circuit) and CCR(close-circut)?

 

[ucfdiver]

TSandM: the wkpp incident was interesting but do we know what rebreather the diver was using. From my understanding the wkpp rebreather doesn't monitor po2... Is that right? Pscr? I don't think we can compare the two incidents at this point until we know what rebreather was being used. Maybe I'm way off but an O2 sensor would seem to have saved the Wkp guy.
So you know I don't dive rebreathers but would like to know if or why I am wrong on this.

Todd Leonard posted that the diver was using a Halcyon RB80. During training for that unit, buyers are provided with a Fio2 drop chart that shows what the loop ppo2 should be with specific bellows which effect the amount of gas exhaled from the loop with every breath.

Had the WKPP diver been using a ppo2 monitor, the device would have shown a 2.0ppo2. Clearly anyone who chooses to dive SCR has to decide for themselves if their existing protocol is enough, or of a ppo2 monitor for one extra safety check is worth the risk of it failing. I would feel safe saying that she was inferring that the monitor would have alerted the diver that the wrong drive gas was plugged in.

Do you know the differences between SCR(semi-close circuit) and CCR(close-circut)?

I don't think the differences is really relevant in the context of his question, hyperoxia is hyperoxia CCR or SCR, even though you get there differently.

 

[DandyDon]

Former Bentley student dies while diving at Andrea Doria site - The Boston Globe

Former Bentley student is 16th diver to die exploring the Andrea Doria

The holy grail of shipwrecks was within Michael LaPrade’s grasp when he vanished.

As he drifted 25 feet above the skeletal remains of the Andrea Doria, buffeted by icy currents some 40 miles south of Nantucket, LaPrade let go of the rope that anchored him and two other divers to the surface 20 stories above.

“They turned around, and he was gone,’’ Edward V. Ecker Jr., chief of the East Hampton, N.Y., Police Department, said yesterday. “Just all of a sudden.’’

Fellow divers found LaPrade’s body Sunday afternoon on the ocean floor near the wreck, three hours after he disappeared, officials said, and took it to shore in Montauk, N.Y. The cause of death is under investigation.

The 27-year-old Los Angeles man, who attended Bentley University in Waltham, is the 16th to die in the quest to swim through the labyrinth of debris that was once the Andrea Doria, an Italian luxury liner that sank off the coast of Nantucket 55 years ago Monday.

“He’d been planning that dive for six months, and it was the thrill of a lifetime,’’ his father, Paul LaPrade, 60, said by phone from Phoenix. “But I told him he shouldn’t do it, because it’s such an unsafe place.’’

After LaPrade disappeared, two others began a time-consuming ascent in hopes of finding him. But there was no sign of him. A report of a missing diver came in to the Coast Guard Sector Southeast New England at 12:11 p.m. Sunday, said spokesman Ronny German. A helicopter, plane, and boat searched for LaPrade’s body on the surface, while fellow divers descended again. They brought the body to the surface at about 3:40 p.m.

Each year, hundreds make the 240-foot descent, thought of as the Mount Everest of scuba diving, through frigid waters, fierce currents, and changeable weather conditions to swim near the once-majestic 700-foot ship, which rests moldering on its right side near the edge of the continental shelf.

Divers are drawn to the wreck’s mystique, but also the challenge of the dive. It is more than twice the normal depth of a recreational dive, and movement grows increasingly difficult the deeper one goes. It is more dangerous near the wreck, where corrosive salt water has eaten away at the ship’s iron and copper fixtures, leaving stairways, bridges, and staterooms in a pile of debris.

“There’s nothing a technical diver loves more than a challenge,’’ said Ernest Rookey of New Jersey, who has done the Doria dive dozens of times. “Why do we climb mountains? Why do we go to the moon? Because it’s there. Because we can.’’

The autopsy and preliminary investigation of LaPrade’s scuba gear are being performed by the Suffolk County, N.Y. medical examiner, but results are not expected immediately. The East Hampton Police Department and the Long Island Sound sector of the US Coast Guard will investigate the death over the next two to six months, officials at those agencies said.

LaPrade made his dive from the John Jack, a New Jersey-based charter boat that is one of the few to undertake the challenges of a trip to the Andrea Doria: tons of supplies to shuttle to the dive site, which is outside phone service range, and the knowledge that divers could die during the weeklong voyage. The John Jack’s captain, Rich Benevento declined to comment.

Coast Guard officials said LaPrade had six hours of air in his tanks when he began his dive and had been below the surface less than an hour when he disappeared.

Andrea Doria hopefuls train and plan for years for the depth, which requires special equipment and a cocktail of oxygen, nitrogen, and helium to combat the effect of water pressure on the body and brain. Typical dives last between 2 1/2 and 3 hours. No sunlight reaches the bottom, and depending on weather and water conditions, visbility can range from 5 to 70 feet and is subject to change at any moment.

More than a third of the divers who have died at the wreck have suffocated after tangling their air hoses or tanks in nets, cargo lines, pipes, and other debris along the ocean floor, Rookey said.

“After three hours in the water, you’re tired, you’re cold, you’re wet,’’ Rookey said. “That’s a very bad time for something bad to happen.’’

LaPrade began diving when he was a teenager, his father said, and had done deep shipwreck dives in Belize, Mexico, and along the west coast of the United States.

“Diving around the world was what he loved to do more than anything,’’ Paul LaPrade said. “He’s very experienced, and diving was his passion, without question.’’

Michael LaPrade played football at Bentley University in Waltham and worked for a toy import company in Los Angeles, near where he frequently made dives, his father said. He leaves three younger brothers and a large extended family.

The deaths of those seeking the Andrea Doria are a strange adjunct to the ship’s story of survival: Of 1,660 passengers and crew aboard, 97 percent survived. The 16 who died in a dive to the wreck are a third as many as those who died originally.

“That in itself makes the Doria a positive story,’’ Rookey said. “It’s not a war grave; it doesn’t have baggage or a lot of negativity; you don’t get that spooky feeling of a ghost looking over your shoulder as you swim through her remains.’’

 

[knowone]

I just wonder sometimes how the body copes with the brain that owns it

 

[Quero]

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[dab]

The question I have always had about this dive, is why do it? There is nothing there but deep dark cold water, current, and a pile of junk. There is no history there, all the mystery about the wreck has been explored, why do it? Is it the deep dark cold water and current that motivates divers to make this dive? Or is it the pile of junk (if it's the junk, you can walk around any auto wrecking yard and see the same thing at almost no risk)?
I hate to say it, but I think it comes down to bragging rights. I have watched the tech community since the early 90's and you would think after 20 years it would have grown out of this mentality. Dora is not Everest, it's a pile of junk sitting in 200 ft. of current filled, cold dark water. This dive is not worth anyone's life.

What makes you think the Doria is a pile of junk? Decks are collapsing and areas previously open to penetration no longer exist, but new areas are opening up. The bow now has a
large crack in it that allows access to completely new areas. Last year the forward bell was found, a very significant find. The Doria represents a great challenge to explore
something very historic as well as accomplish something very difficult. It comes with significant risk. A choice we all make. The Empress of Ireland is another example of a
collapsing wreck that is closing off some areas and opening up new areas as she deteriorates.

 

[Akimbo]

What makes you think the Doria is a pile of junk? ...

In the salvage business, any wreck that is not cost effective to raise is junk.

Everything is relative. Compared to “the good old days” she has certainly deteriorated faster than one might expect. The use of Aluminum in the superstructure was an innovation in the early 1950s when she was built. Even by 1973, a lot was gone including most of the bridge house. Aluminum acts as a sacrificial anode to the steel. That is why WWII warships are in relatively good shape even though they have been underwater 10+ years longer.

 

[Rhone Man]

Yes, the Doria is not what it once was. The wreck has broken down greatly and the treasures to be found there are becoming harder to find. (not that a bunch of China is "treasure" but you know what I mean)

...

You can call it "bragging rights" if you like but there will always be people that desire to see the thing for themselves and make their own decision about it's history and where that "history" fits into their lives and memories.

I grew up in the era where the Doria was the ultimate test of a diver's skill. Even if the challenge seems much smaller in the modern era, I would love to dive the Grand Dame, just once, and just "because". As Dr Wu says, whether you consider that "bragging rights" or nostalgia and a sense of wreck diving history is a question of perception.

Former Bentley student dies while diving at Andrea Doria site - The Boston Globe

That is a nice piece of journalism. Pleasant change to see someone doing their research instead of the usual rubbish about a diver "running out of oxygen" (although on the Doria that wouldn't sound quite so stupid).