Bungeed wings...

[The Chairman]

Hey ID, & all,

I agree with the amount of of lift being excessive, but I would rather have too much than be stuck at the bottome with a problem of some sort. BTW, didn't you see me actually raise the Hunley??? I got it on display now... ;-)

The dual bladders I think ARE exceptional. I like redundancy, I like redundancy. It keeps things safe, it keeps things safe. (Ok I'll stop that now, it can get irritating)I would like to see smaller redudant bladders, but they are not out there. You see, thats the GREAT point... if my TUSA Duo-Air jams, I unplug it and use the OTHER INFLATOR on my right side. I don't have to end the dive, just continue with the redundant equipment. I also dive with a pony bottle, if you are concerned about whether I can still breath or not. (probably not as concerned as I am... ;-)

The OMS IQ is a blackplate system, with a bit of padding between it and the diver. I love mine, and choose to dive it over the other BCs I have. IT is very configurable and versatile, whether I am using my twin steels or just an AL tank.

Dry suit??? My God man, I live in FLorida, where the springs are 72 F year round. I bet you even have to wear a jacket or a coat during the winter... How uncivilised (big grin)...

Pete from Orlando...

 

[ericfine50]

Pete,
100 pounds of lift is WAY to much. Your rig needs to be balanced (ie Ditchable weight).With a set of LP of AL doubles, you only need half that lift. And if you do get a puncture, you do have a buddy to assist you and a gear check before you enter the water should catch any problems pre dive.

Drysuits, well I go caving for a week or two a year in Fl and I use my CF200.Actually, I don't remember when I used a wetsuit last. Anything below 98 degrees and you will get hypothermia at some point.

Just curious, do you dive singles or doubles?

Take Care,
Eric

 

[Atomox]

Pete,

The comment that given a problem with one of redundant wings, inflators or other pieces of equipment will allow you to continue diving is a very dangerous attitude. It also underscores the fact that you don't really need the redundancy of dual wings, inflators, etc.

The OMS IQ system is very techie looking and way cool (for the inexperienced) but it is a fatality waiting to happen. The bungies increase drag, can limit the inflation volume of the wings, can prevent the inflation of the wings, can cause the dumping of any inflation if punctured, have additional failure points, and cost more.

Why do you want to deal with all of these definite shortcomings with a piece of lifesaving equipment? Is it because it hurts to admit that your equipment choice was not the best? Get used to it, there is all kinds of junk and dangerous dive gear out there. I believe that everyone has bought some of it at one time or another.

Eric and Don have identified some other very good points with a well thought out and SAFE gear configuration. It would be to your benefit to reread the comments and then do a little research about them. Then go and dive this type of setup.

Brad

 

[The Chairman]

Hey Eric, Brad, & All,

Eric- I usually dive single hp steel 120s, but sometimes will use my old twins (steel 72s). Most of my diving is in springs or off the coast further down south. I have never had to deal with the issues we are talking about... ie snags and such, or runaway inflation. I have contemplated them, practiced around them, and feel quite comfortable with this set up.

Brad- I do like the way the OMS looks- shoot me, I am guilty there. However, I am not a tech diver, nor do I pretend to be. I have several BCs to choose from (most jacket style) and I just plain prefer the OMS on my body. It feels great! It doesn't shift, I never get squeezed, I know each and every control intimately. As for a dangerous attitude, I believe in redundancy. I dive with a depth guage and a computer (sometimes two, if I am going under the 100' mark). I wear a watch and time my dive as well. I ALWAYS have two lights on me (unless the law prohibits it, and even more in confined spaces or at night), and I usually dive with a reel as well. There are many, many things that would cause me to abort a dive instantaeneously. However, if a light is not working I switch to #2, if a reg pucked on me,though, I would use the pony blottle to surface slowly. I will not depend on another diver who might be thirty feet away to provide me with assistance. Yes, I dive solo too. I think the solo C card is the way to go, when they get it to my area.

Now I will ponder what has been said, and will learn something from all on this list. I may not arrive at the same conclusions that you have, and that may frustrate you. I like OMS... I just do. None of my instructors (from OW thru Divemaster, Nitrox, and Deep Diver) have had anything negative to say about my OMS, OR the way I have it set up. They do tease me when I go down with doubles (isolation manifold- dual regs) AND my pony bottle. Thats 3 regs and an integrated octo dangling all over me, and thats OK... Just call me paranoid.

 

[Atomox]

Just some thoughts on OMS wings.

1. Bungee wings have elastic cord laced around the bladder to supposedly keep it tight and streamlined at all times. What actually occurs is that surface folds are created in the wing, which with the bungees themselves increase turbulent water flow over this surface and thus the diver's drag.
2. The fore and aft profile is also greater with the bungeed wings. (More drag, heavier exertion, CO2 loading, etc.)
3. The bungees are very good entanglement points that pose an entrapment hazard. The bungee can not be easily reached if they do become snagged.
4. The bungees also serve to hold the bladder close to the diver's center of gravity, which makes it easier to roll, but makes it more difficult to maintain a perfect prone attitude in water. The standard unrestrained wings will float upward against the side of your tanks, resulting in a greater applied moment which helps keep you in a horizontal position, which is generally the position of greatest function for the diver (certainly from a decompression perspective).
5. The bungees also create a slight positive pressure within the bladder at all times, which will act to forcefully dump the wing when you hit the deflate. This is a faster dumping than the standard wing, but if you have a valve or fitting failure your gas may be all inadvertently dumped - very dangerous in an emergency situation.
6. The positive pressure in the restrained wing also creates a lung loading problem when orally inflating - just one more thing to contribute to injury or DCS.
7. This positive pressure in the bladder complicates using the inflator as a tertiary backup regulator,
8. OMS provides buoyancy compensators with as much as one hundred pounds of lift (as advertised by the manufacturer). If a diver is using the correct tanks for his or her particular application (considering the buoyancy characteristics) and is correctly weighted, there is absolutely no need for this amount of buoyancy in any situation.
9. Bungee wings were developed in response to the perceived need for additional buoyancy to support excessively weighted divers. It is irresponsible to dive with weight that cannot be ditched in an emergency and the use of a gross displacement device is a mistaken compensation for an erroneous practice.
10. Cost more

A diver must "settle for nothing less than perfection. Those who do will discover on their own the value
of such effort. Those who do not will never understand what the others are talking about".

Brad

 

[Atomox]

Pete,

The redunancy of dual bladder wings was the issue. Not of lights or regulators or the most important of all the BUDDY.

Brad

 

[The Chairman]

Ye gads man,

Here we have opened up YET ANOTHER controversial issue. When I am with a "buddy", I am usually the "leader", mentor, or what ever you want to call it. I have to look out for their butt... I am always checking their air, their bouyancy, their this, their that, its like a job to go diving with some people. Yes, there are those people I actually like to dive with, because I can trust them to pull their weight and actually check guages. However, when I am on a dive boat and they assign me a buddy... holy heck Batman! It seems that they always try to buddy the week with the strong, the competent with the "in", and it really sucks. I dive for me. (notice period after the word "me") If I am helping to teach a class as Dive Master, then thats one thing... but on my own time, I prefer to dive alone. The solo C-Card suits me just fine!!!

Pete from Orlando...

 

[Atomox]

Yeah but can you make a good cup of coffee?

 

[Aegir]

Hmmm is it even possible to make a bad cup of coffee?

 

[The Chairman]

OK, Hombres,

Like, not only can I make a good cup of Java, but I can grow it too... I am from Orlando now, but my COO (country of origin) is Columbia in South America... a little town on the coast called Barranquilla! For what its worth, though, I am a gringo thru n' thru. Blonde hair, blue eyes, and speak only bambino espanol, but my passport is from Columbia!

Pete from Orlando... formerly from Columbia...