An age-old question: ways to 60m.

[Olsen_No]

The gap between perceived risk and real risk is to large within diving... You never see any skydivers debating or arguing about the need for a reserve chute but with diving, people tend to dramatically underestimate the risk if they have a single failure or issue..

 

[leadduck]

Yeah the Rouse's would like a word about deep air being "safe"

Their accident is such a case that I meant. They had experience with deep air and felt safe. But on their last dive a problem occurred (trapped inside a wreck) causing a lot of workload and stress, eventually ending in a deadly emergency ascent. With trimix and a clear head they maybe could have solved the problem earlier, maybe would have found their stage bottles and anchor line. If the trapping problem had not occurred, this would have been one more uneventful deep air dive on their list with no noticed impairment, justifying more deep air diving in their mind.

 

[happy-diver]

Well well well, you pulled this one out of your hat, and even scored yourself some other questionable likers
like the inevitability of those Rouses who in poor conditions weren't feeling it were going to sit out the dive
but immaturely as they mostly acted, the son with questionable psychology, goaded each other into diving
and ended up where they may always have been going

Air or mix

Yeah the Rouse's would like a word about deep air being "safe"

 

[CG43]

NothingClever wrote about Gilliam's 490 feet dive :

Also, I’m not sure I buy the assertion of no narcosis. I think that’s an aspirational claim rather than a reality.

The only thing we know for sure is that his problems were not so big that they killed him.
But isn't that reason enough to look for what he did better than other divers ?

I have never done a deep or deep air course and don't know what is taught there and when I ask I don't get an answer.
When I see lists of symptoms that are so theoretical that you can't do anything useful with them in diving practice. All this gives the impression that diving with air is no longer desirable and that people are frantically looking for reasons for this. The failure of incomplete training is that you end up with unnecessary problems at relatively shallow depths. Ah , you can choose an even shallower depth limit and there is also helium , right , this is one way.
But you can't change human nature so quickly, especially not that of young male.

 

[SelfDiver]

The gap between perceived risk and real risk is to large within diving... You never see any skydivers debating or arguing about the need for a reserve chute but with diving, people tend to dramatically underestimate the risk if they have a single failure or issue..

How much evidence would you need to see in order to change your opinion on this?

 

[VsubT]

The gap between perceived risk and real risk is to large within diving... You never see any skydivers debating or arguing about the need for a reserve chute but with diving, people tend to dramatically underestimate the risk if they have a single failure or issue..

You’d think so. I have literally watched this “but I don’t need a reserve” discussion in person multiple times at drop zones. Usually coming from a new base jumper who wants to jump their base rig + canopy from a skydive plane for practice. They perceive it as safer than jumping it for the first time at a base site. The DZO generally has a different view.

There’s a broad spectrum of risk tolerance between individuals. A few folks have enough experience or talent to regularly do things that others of us cannot. The problems usually manifest when an inexperienced person has a high risk tolerance and mediocre ability, then manages to get themselves into an unforgiving activity.

I chose OC tri-mix as my path to 60m, but I also respect that physiology and gas availability drive others to different choices.

Lance

 

[NothingClever]

But isn't that reason enough to look for what he did better than other divers ?

No, not really for me.

The part of that dive that is supposed to be the working part of the dive is so brief that I just don’t find the exploration value in it. There might be some mild interest in his physical prep right before his descent but only if it has some application in my diving. That much said, the other thing I don’t buy is his 14bpm HR.

I acknowledge I benefit from Brett Gilliam’s UW activities because I trained with TDI but that’s a thready lineage.

I would get far more excited reading about somebody using a set of HP130s, clipping onto an expedition grade DPV and conducting a long exploratory cruise (as in 15 miles) along a coast like Bonaire.

Horizontal exploration promises more reward for me than does vertical exploration.

With vertical exploration, I want an objective but the super deep profiles don’t offer anything but a brief glimpse.

With horizontal exploration, memorable observations of sealife and topography over an extended amount of time is the objective. It’s sightseeing on an industrial scale.

 

[eightytwenty]

No, not really for me.

The part of that dive that is supposed to be the working part of the dive is so brief that I just don’t find the exploration value in it. There might be some mild interest in his physical prep right before his descent but only if it has some application in my diving. That much said, the other thing I don’t buy is his 14bpm HR.

I acknowledge I benefit from Brett Gilliam’s UW activities because I trained with TDI but that’s a thready lineage.

I would get far more excited reading about somebody using a set of HP130s, clipping onto an expedition grade DPV and conducting a long exploratory cruise (as in 15 miles) along a coast like Bonaire.

Horizontal exploration promises more reward for me than does vertical exploration.

With vertical exploration, I want an objective but the super deep profiles don’t offer anything but a brief glimpse.

With horizontal exploration, memorable observations of sealife and topography over an extended amount of time is the objective. It’s sightseeing on an industrial scale.

Pretty much every story Gilliam told was a tall tale. The guy was a chest beating weenie and if you read his accounts of his 490-foot dive or his shark attack story you'll realize pretty quickly that the guy is totally full of it and just wanted people to think he was cool.

 

[CG43]

No, not really for me.

The part of that dive that is supposed to be the working part of the dive is so brief that I just don’t find the exploration value in it. There might be some mild interest in his physical prep right before his descent but only if it has some application in my diving.

You have every right to see it that way, and other divers to see it differently:

"The scuba diver dives to look around while the freediver dives to look inside himself ".
Umberto Pelizzzari freedivechampion .

And if the freedive skills are not sufficient then most ambitious freediver also takes a scuba.

 

[flymolo]

Pretty much every story Gilliam told was a tall tale. The guy was a chest beating weenie and if you read his accounts of his 490-foot dive or his shark attack story you'll realize pretty quickly that the guy is totally full of it and just wanted people to think he was cool.

yeah totally. i was reminded of this article

The Call of the Wah-Wah

The lingering legacy of DEEP AIR in the era of MIX—from the aquaCORPS archives

indepthmag.com