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Couv,
Thank you for the kind words, we are glad to be here.
Brian
Thank you for the kind words, we are glad to be here.
Brian
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Rest assured I am fairly well versed on the review process having done that dance before. I appreciate the review.Hello Steve:
Thanks for your posting and questions.
I think the best way for me to answer is to begin by describing some of the background process that goes into course development at International Training.
Our curriculum is reviewed on a regular basis. This review process is a complex one but boiled down to its basics it puts our courses in context with currently accepted safe diving practices, what the various markets globally will willingly accept, and what our insurance coverage will tolerate. Theres more to it than that but that paints the picture with broad strokes. The review process also involves a lot of people with a tremendous amount of recreational dive industry experience in retail, manufacturing and teaching as well as in a variety of other branches of applied diving such as commercial, scientific, and military applications. These people include our training department, training advisory panel, HQ staff instructors, our cadre of instructor-trainers and the regional partners that represent International Training (SDI, TDI and ERDI) around the world.
You must have misunderstood. As you know Steve was my mix instructor, so you know beyond a shadow of a doubt that I am well versed in the course progression, standards, and what is and is not mandatory etc. I also have been around other classes and know the rather huge variations that develop under the standard.The addition of a new standard for another helium-based program has been discussed quite regularly, and was a topic at the last Global Strategy Meeting we hosted in May of 2006. I suspect it may well come up again at the next GSM scheduled for May 2008, in Maine.
At the moment, we do not see it being a required program since we already offer helium-based training at two levels, and this approach has been very successful for us for more than a decade. I have not looked at the figures for technical certifications in southern Ontario recently but I know that Steve Lewis who is now on staff here at HQ and who was a valued member of our training advisory board, and I understand was your trimix instructor moved away from that area a couple of years ago, but I think any void that may have been left by Steves departure was amply filled by several other equally competent and very senior instructors who work out of the eastern GTA. Last I heard these people are doing very well. There may not be a senior TDI technical instructor in your city, but total saturation is not part of our marketing strategy. I am sure someone looking for training in your area could find good technical instruction without too much trouble and would be welcome to contact TDI HQ for some suggestions.
You bring up two very puzzling points in your posting. I may have misunderstood but you seem to be under the impression that TDI does not promote safe diving practices and that we do not offer an entry-level trimix course. Both of these are incorrect.
While I appreciate the history lesson, I have to say I am far more interested in spending my time with moving forward to what we will be doing, and spending less time sitting in the past. In fact, as I understand it this is what your initial post requested, continued input from divers in order to move forward. This is no longer 1994, thank goodness. Anyone living off of past graces needs to really wake up.TDI was the first certification agency to offer an introductory trimix course with standards that made it very easy for someone who needed to use helium mixes on deeper dives to get quality training without jumping through hoops The maximum depth that graduates from this course are certified to dive to is 60 metres or 200 feet or the deepest depth attained during the class whichever is shallower. As with all our training standards, there is no minimum depth specified. Once qualified a diver may use any mix he chooses as long as it can be breathed at surface pressure without ill effects from hypoxia.
Trimix training prior to our introduction of this type of training was difficult to find and hard to sign-up for and our liberal approach to advanced diver training was a huge factor in TDI becoming the largest technical training agency in the world. A position we have managed to hold on to since 1994 in an increasingly competitive market segment from agencies like NAUI, which you mentioned. I would agree that NAUI has a very good program (many senior TDI instructors taught for NAUI prior to joining us by the way, myself included), and we respect them as an agency.
In 20 words or less?With regards to diver safety and knowledge, I fail to see how adding helium to our current decompression program adds to diver safety or knowledge. Please explain that.
Ah, now were getting there and have found some common ground. I knew it was in there somewhere. I agree entirely. I should also take this time to suggest to you the working end of a new decompression diver in my area. Its not unique I know, but it will lead into your next point.Helium is used principally to manage the partial pressure of oxygen and nitrogen in deeper, more complex dives. There is debate about where the best depth for this type of management begins. You mentioned local conditions and since I have dove in your general area several times Id guess you mean cold, dark water, and sometimes working hard. Given this, most of us would start using helium much shallower than we would diving somewhere warm, clear and calm. Thats a given.
The maximum modest depth limit is 150ft. A depth weve already agreed upon could use mix under certain circumstances, especially in areas such as mine.Decompression Procedures has a very specific skill-set attached to it. And very modest depth limits. The maximum depth for the course would be outside the comfort range of some in Great Lakes conditions, but of course this course can be, and is, conducted in very shallow water. Ive seen it conducted successfully in less than 80 feet of water off the east coast.
So now its 130ft. Where did that come from? Opt? The deco card and manuals still states 150ft, and its sold and marketed as such. A mix card beyond 130ft. Ill await the update to the manuals I guess, because I dont see that as a standard anywhere in the newest batch. Most divers would have assumed they opted to dive to a max of 150ft on air prior to even contemplating mix because that has been and is the implication we give, but I see weve already decided why thats not a good idea. Again, the class is never written up, sold or publicly perceived in a manner you are trying to light it with. Public perception of a deco course is beyond NDL and deeper than 130ft. We lever than belief and are willing and more than happy to do so. Of course its nicely worded so you can always state the following .Graduates from this class can then go on to conduct increasingly more complex staged decompression dives and when they have some experience in this area, may opt to dive below the industry standard 40 metres 130 feet by enrolling in a trimix class.
Mmmm, current standards ..It sounds like you have read standards and misunderstood what they actually mean. None of maximum depths cited in TDI course standards are required depths for successful completion of the course. They are outside limits and cannot be exceeded by our instructors at any time. Our instructors are encouraged to modify courses within standards to suit local conditions. If your experience with Steve Lewis or any other TDI instructor was different (Ill be surprised) but I would like to hear about it.
This would be food for another day, but the working reality of it is if you cant dive in 80ft of water safely, you neednt go any deeper with any gas, much less a technical course of any kind. If this doesnt stand as obvious to just about anyone at any level, we have greater issues to deal with.Safety in deep diving is much more than adding helium to ones mix. Gas management, situational awareness, buddy skills, buoyancy, equipment selection and management are all far more important on a dive between 30 and 40 metres (100 and 130 feet). And TDIs current course line-up does an excellent job of teaching those skills as a foundation for deeper dives on helium.
Whether I agree or disagree is not really the point.I feel our program is superior and offers divers and instructors a clear and user-friendly path to promote diver knowledge and safety. I am sorry you choose to disagree.
Steve R,
Flame the Pres of a training agency on a welcome thread... classy!
It's not too late to delete and start your own thread.
Chad Carney (No relation to Brian)