Waivers for Clubs - How long can they be 'good' for?

[fmerkel]

I'm president of a dive club. We are very active, have 150+ members and usually schedule something like 150 dives/year.
Like most clubs that I've checked we historically have an annual waiver signed with membership renewal.
With a change in times, we are looking at Paypal for renewals. We tried this last year along with the usual old method (checks and cash + signed waiver). It turned out to be a problem getting some members to follow up getting us a signed waiver. We do accept scanned/faxed or mailed in copies of CURRENTLY signed waivers. Somehow good people that have paid their money seem to simply forget that they have not followed up. Yes, we've considered simply 'cutting them off' but this seems an unfriendly action in a club setting. We're all trying to have a good time here.

Accounting and renewal would be a lot easier if we could have new members sign a waiver, and allow that to stand as long as the the member remained in continuous good standing. I've got members telling me to consult a lawyer. Without shelling out Club $$ I've talked to a number of lawyers informally. I get the spectrum from 'you need to get a signed waiver every year' to 'that should be good enough'. I'm NOT a lawyer. The closer I get to stuff like this the more confusing it gets. The law close up is not nearly as solid as I would like it.

I certainly would appreciate any input, especially from lawyers familiar with this particular kind of problem or clubs that have investigated this and what their findings have been.

Fritz Merkel
President - Marker Buoy Dive Club

 

[knotical]

Not an attorney, but a potential administrative technique.

Have a stack of waivers handy when the members arrive to participate in whatever activity you’d need a waiver for. No current waiver, no participation.

 

[fmerkel]

Yes, that's a technique we try to use when possible. The club utilizes what we call 'dive hosts', individuals that put on a dive. They are just regular members, not connected with the administrative activity, nor should they need to be. The trouble is they won't know who has neglected to sign this year's waiver or not. We do try to get people to sign up beforehand for dives but sometime folks just show up.

I do appreciate the suggestion.

Fritz

 

[FM1520]

Why do you charge for membership? I belong to a club called Power Scuba (Power Scuba (aka Scuba Diving in San Diego County) (La Jolla, CA) - Meetup) here in San Diego its free to join. We do wavers at the events.

 

[MrChen]

If you collect online have you considered digital signatures? I'm on my kindle right now, next time I'm on my computer I'll get a link for you. Digital signatures are recognized by govt agencies in the medical field for items like prescriptions which are presented in court when an audit is done. Maybe this could apply here as well.

Sent from my Kindle Fire using Tapatalk 2

---------- Post added August 4th, 2013 at 09:08 AM ----------

So I have some experience with EchoSign (https://www.echosign.adobe.com/en/home.html). You get to design an acrobat template online and specify required/optional fields and a signature.

They price it by users, meaning how many users in your organization need to manage the templates and monitor the signed documents. Sounds like you might only need a couple (yourself and maybe secretary of the club).

Give them a call, I'm sure they'll be more than happy to demo and discuss it, including how the digital signature can be applied legally.

 

[fmerkel]

Membership fees are function of how a club chooses to operate and services it provides. We have a stable clubhouse we have rented for years to host monthly meetings (not a bar or restaurant like many). We have speakers and presentations most meetings. We host a large annual banquet, a summer picnic, and pumpkin carving contest. One of our major perks is offering a 10-fill air card from local shops (we buy them, they aren't gifts) for hosting a dive which meets certain criteria. This has been an effective incentive to keep our remarkable dive calendar running for years. Last year we contributed $1300 (and a LOT of UW work) toward significant safety improvements on 2 local well used dive sites. That kind of stuff takes money.

I'll check into that echosign. Some previous investigation on that kind of service seems to have had issues but I'll call. I looked over the pricing and it's not certain how we would fit into that.

 

[MrChen]

Don't tell them but setup 1 User and just share it.

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[Tom Winters]

Easier to do it annually if you can. Then you can hunt down the strays as they pop up at dives. At an event, it can get busy, plus you have all these signed forms to not lose.

 

[fmerkel]

Easier to do it annually if you can. Then you can hunt down the strays as they pop up at dives. At an event, it can get busy, plus you have all these signed forms to not lose.

Renewals are annual. These are divers....renewals trickle in over months no matter how much you hound them. Since dives are not run by the Secretary with a list of non-renewed/signed members it's rather difficult to dump that responsibility on the dive host.

Remember, we are not a shop, not instructors, not a business, we are a club. The dynamics are different.

 

[Tom Winters]

I understand your dynamics. I guess when you can get electronic waivers, that'll make your life easier. Good luck with that.

If you ever look for a position herding cats, this club stuff will look really good.