Sidemount Instruction/Gear

[Pao]

I am interested in going into sidemount diving. Before I take the leap I would like to know what is available locally in terms of instruction and gear. I was initially thinking of doing the TDI AN/DP course but was a bit put-off by the logistics of lugging/availability of back mounted doubles. Is there a recreational sidemount course that teaches you in the 2 bottle configuration? Can you do An/DP in sidemount? What gear is available locally and how much (I am leaning towards a minimalist configuration)? Can you adapt a BP/W configuration for sidemount? How different is it from the Hogarthian style/configuration? Is the transition difficult?

Sorry for all the questions and thanks in advance!

 

[decompression]

Checkout Unified Team Diving, they have all configurations of sidemount, including rebreather. Also, every course they offer can be in sidemount. Good luck! I use a backplate with a UTD delta wing which can be configured as sidemount, all the UTD gear configurations are hogarthian.

Poby Han Philippines - ko, en	OW, Foundational, Z-SM	poby@unifiedteamdiving.com	+63 9177230119

Juan Naval Philippines - en, ph	OW, Foundational, Z-SM, Rec. Side Mount	juan.naval@unifiedteamdiving.com	+63 9178333047

 

[JamesK]

My answers are below.

I am interested in going into sidemount diving. Before I take the leap I would like to know what is available locally in terms of instruction and gear. I was initially thinking of doing the TDI AN/DP course but was a bit put-off by the logistics of lugging/availability of back mounted doubles. Is there a recreational sidemount course that teaches you in the 2 bottle configuration? YES Can you do An/DP in sidemount? YES What gear is available locally and how much (I am leaning towards a minimalist configuration)? Can you adapt a BP/W configuration for sidemount? You can, but with the kits available today, you are better off buying a kit. How different is it from the Hogarthian style/configuration? My setup is a UTD Harness and Z wing setup. My single tank setup is very much Hogarthian aside from my tank being on my side. My doubles rig is as well. The only difference is having to change regs to keep my tanks close in pressure. UTD has a manifold setup where you do not have to do that, and are always breathing off the long hose, and they now have an isolation manifold as well. I have not tried it, so I can not comment on it. Is the transition difficult? It can be. I did not have a mentor or instructor. I learned it through trial and error by myself. I also have had the opprotunity to dive as much as I want for free over the past year though. I would highly recommend an instructor. Check with DevonDiver on this forum. I am sure he will chime in here. With a good instructor the transition will be very easy.

Sorry for all the questions and thanks in advance!

 

[Pao]

Thanks guys!

 

[limbo]

Devon Diver, a very regular poster and moderator on this board is a side mount instructor and he can teach recreational side mount courses. He lives in the Philippines and teaches mostly out of Subic.

 

[DevonDiver]

Hi guys, thanks for the mention.

There's quite a few sidemount instructors around the Philippines now, teaching courses for various agencies and in various configurations.

In addition to the UTD course/instructors mentioned, here are some more (by no means an exhaustive list).
Most are not rig specific, but can arrange rental Hollis, OMS, UTD or Z-System etc.

Andy Davis (me) - PADI Recreational Sidemount and TecRec Tec Sidemount
Bruce Konefe - ANDI Sidemount / Advanced Sidemount
Boardwalk Dive Center - PSAI sidemount
Johan's Dive Center - PADI Recreational Sidemount in OMS.

The PADI Rec Sidemount is designed for recreational divers - 1 or 2 tanks. The Tec Sidemount goes slightly further and introduces stage cylinders, as preparation for, or conversion to, technical level courses in sidemount rig.

Is there a recreational sidemount course that teaches you in the 2 bottle configuration?

Yes, there are recreational level sidemount courses. PADI have a new one, as do ANDI. Not sure about the other agencies.

Can you do An/DP in sidemount?

The PADI tech curriculum can be completed in sidemount, once qualified. Not sure about other agencies. I did the ANDI Technical Wreck course in Sidemount - was awesome - but not sure about their entry-level tech courses. Will get an answer on that, if you need it.

What gear is available locally and how much (I am leaning towards a minimalist configuration)?

Diver's Point - UTD sidemount
Boardwalk - Z-System and Hollis
Nautilus - OMS Profile/Tesseract

I believe that Aquamundo is also developing a sidemount rig - will be similar in style to UTD and Z-System, but likely much cheaper.

The most minimalist configurations are the UTD, Z-System and Hollis SMS50.

The UTD and Z-System are around ~$800. The SMS50 is around ~$550.

Can you adapt a ​

BP/W

configuration for sidemount?

Yes, you can adapt from BP/W. Here's a thread detailing how I did that:
​

http://www.scubaboard.com/forums/si...ject-frankenstein-my-diy-sidemount-trial.html

How different is it from the Hogarthian style/configuration? Is the transition difficult?​

With the right instruction, it's very easy to transition. For most rigs, the harness is worn the same way as a 'hog' BP/W - a simple one-piece affair, with crotch-strap. The Hollis SMS100 is more similar to a 'comfort/deluxe' harness set-up.

As with BP/W set-up, it pays dividends to get the sizing/fitting right in the first instance. Some educated guidance helps that immensely, just as it does with BP/W fitting.

Other than that, diving sidemount is very instinctive and easy. You'll be loving it by the end of a course.


More about sidemount training and courses: Sidemount Diving | Course Notes | Advanced Scuba

 

[Karl_H]

Hi Pao,

Just to throw our name in to the equation Divers Network was actually one of the pioneers in bringing sidemount diving to the Philippines, we've been teaching sidemount courses since 2009 and can teach almost all courses in sidemount, from recreational courses through to advanced trimix and even have been playing with sidemount CCRs since 2010.

To answer your questions, the advanced sidemount (two tanks) course is generally considered a recreational course, although it covers many aspects of a technical course s could be considered a bridging gap between the two. The majority of Technical courses, PADI, TDI and UTD can all be taught using a sidemount configuration.

If you are planning on diving in only warm water there really only two harness systems to consider, the Razor and the UTD Z-System. The other harnesses are intended for cold water diving with steel tanks and really don't work well in warm water conditions or are modifications to a backmount harness which don't work well either. It can be done but it's definitely not recommended as you'll loose a significant chunk of the advantages of sidemount!

The Razor 1 was the real break through harness, although it had no BC so we had to dive using modified MSR packs for buoyancy, this had a few issues (other than the obvious ones!) with keeping the bladder in place but generally worked well. The new Razor 2 harness comes with a double-bladder BC but in all honesty is worse overall than the Razor 1. The workmanship of the bladder is poor while the design is effectively the same as an bungeed BC as air in the bladder tends to be pulled into the center, this makes it more difficult for technical dives where uneven weights are expected on the left or right side of the diver to accommodate deco bottles - this makes balance and trim a little less comfortable.

The UTD harnesses are basically the same as the Razor 1, with a BC attached. The Z-Trim is a smaller bladder and gives the best position/trim for two tanks, but at just 9kg of lift it isn't recommended for technical diving. The Z-plus is a larger capacity bladder with 18kg of lift which works well for technical diving, there's also the Altph/Delta wing which is similar to the Z-Plus but can be used with a backplate for backmount configuration as well as a sidemount configuration with the z-harness (no backplate), it does have a slightly lower lift (14 kg) to accomodate the holes for backmount, but otherwise it's very similar to the Z-plus.

The prices for the Razor are around $800-850 while the UTD Z-harness is normally around 25k php ($575) for the Z-Trim or 30k ($690) for the Z-Plus. The z-harness can also be provided with a manifold to allow hogarthian style diving with an isolator manifold, althoiugh this drives up the price of the UTD harness by around $1000 to cover the manifold, hoses and QC6 connections/units. We stock the UTD harness in the shop.

The sidemount set-up is similar to hogarthian but certainly not the same, the normal set-up is to use completely independent cylinders, although the UTD system (and a few other copies) allow the use of a manifold to give similar hose routing set-up to the hogartian set-up.

Just drop me a line if you need any more info, my email is 'karl@diveph.com'.

Cheers,

Karl

 

[break4]

Hi Karl

It is one thing, that you try to sell your UTD-gear to your customers. As we all know UTD copied the Razor without having no knowledge in Side Mount diving. Reading your post shows me, that you don't have a big idea about Side Mount diving as well.
The only thing I'm asking you is to stop posting lies about the Razor 2 system. It is the only system on the market, that is a originally developed from the Side Mount Professionals Steve Bogaerts and myself and it is by fare still the best and versatile useable system on the market even with all the copies that came out from it.
With the 45 lbs wing you can use it in all dive condditions either cold or warm water.
We tested about ten different wing shapes and the Razor BAT wing is close to the ideal form for diving as well in terms of lateral trim.
The Razor SSide Mount System may be slightly more expensive than the UTD copy. The reason why: we produce high quality in the States and not cheap productions in Asia.

Cheers
HP Hartmann
Go Side Mount

 

[Karl_H]

Hi HP,

Pretty harsh words there?!

I'd agree the Z-System harness is pretty much the Razor, however I'll still stand by my statement the Razor 2 BAT wing was a big disappointment. Sorry if that's not you want to hear but that's just my take on it.

I'm happy to give any feedback if you need it for further development on the next generation Razor? I have no bias towards UTD or Razor as far as products go.

Cheers,

Karl

 

[break4]

Hi Karl
The reason why you were diving with an MSR was, that I wasn't hhappy with the 3 liter camelback, that Steve used 5 years ago. So I found the Dromedary bags with 4, 6 and 10 liters. After our video "Wreckdiving in Sidemount configuration" the whole world was starting to use these camelbacks.
Developing the BAT-wing took us 3/4 of a year with a lot of redefinements and adjustments to get the ideal trim, lift and still the best streamlining.
For warm water diving you may be happy with 9 kilo of lift. Once you start diving with stages in caves or cold water diving with steels, then this is by far not enough lift. The BAT-wing has 22 Kilos of lift, fits EVERYBODY and can be used in cold and in warm water conditions and equipment.
As well because the BAT-Wing can be placed anywhere on the harness you can place it excately where it has to be on the diver. A thing that is impossible with any UTD wing. As well you get a double bladder wind with the BAT-wing which gives you additional safety on your dives with the same volume.
This just to name some advantages against other configurations on the market.
As said for warm water recreational diving your preffered configuration may work fine, but there a good diver can use as well an anker and a lift bag.
But when it comes to hard core diving conditions like diving in real Side Mount cave or in deep cold water dives, then I want to use the best equipment avaiable designed by some of the best divers in this area with a big knowledge about it.
As well just look around, what real Side Mount experts are saying about the manifold idea of UTD. I don't want to go further here.
I know that you are a student of Tom which was trained as well by us to a Basic level. But there is much more than that!
So sorry if you feel offended by my words, but I don't really like to see posts like yours talking about an equipment, they don't really have the knowledge about.

Have a great day!
HP