Self Reliant/Solo pre-requisites vs DiveMaster pre-requisites

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loosenit2

si respiratio sub aqua amet
Scuba Instructor
Divemaster
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I'm a Fish!
So I've been thinking lately. PADI requires that a diver has a pre-requisite 100 dives before enrolling in the self-reliant course; but, they only require that a Divemaster have 40 dives to enroll (60 to complete). Does that make any sense to anyone? You can be a professional who can guide other divers and assist in the instruction of students before you can be responsible for yourself? I was listening to a youtube video by DiversReady on Solo-vs Instabuddy and he made the point that as an instructor you are always solo because a student can't possibly be responsible for an instructor and an instructor can't count on a student to assist them. That makes perfect sense to me. Why then is it ok for a dive professional to be less experienced than a solo diver, or asked another way why must a solo diver be more experienced than a professional?
 
Good point, I don't have a good answer, and I don't think there is one.
But I had the impression that PADI was highly resistant to a Self Reliant course and only got on board at the urging of membership, so I am not surprised if they included a fairly high bar for prerequisites in the course. I haven't reviewed the instructors manual in quite a while, but I used to say that the first half of the course was an explanation of why you shouldn't be doing it.
 
SDI had already instituted 100 dive prerequisite for solo before PADI instituted its Self Reliant diver cert., I imagine it was because the precedent was set.

And it could be a matter of interpretation whether the card is acceptable for solo diving by a dive op.


...he made the point that as an instructor you are always solo because a student can't possibly be responsible for an instructor and an instructor can't count on a student to assist them.

Solo diving is when one dives alone, having students, or a bad buddy is not diving alone and has its own seperate issues. As a solo diver, should I see another diver, I can just swim away, an instructor and buddy diver have other obligations.

As a note, I believe an instructor should be teaching a student to be a good buddy in the pool, well before they are out in open water with them. I guess it depends on whether the instructor wants to just certify the student, or make them a good diver and buddy, how much assistance a student can give.



Bob
 
It is tempting to sell this thread out for a joke, state that you really only need 40 dives to be able to haul other people's gear, turn their air off, and get lost, and leave it at that. I'll try harder, because there have been a few divemasters that have made a difference in my diving (and not the kind of difference that the guy who turned off my air made).

I'm unsure what purpose the "divemaster" certification actually serves other than transferring the cost of training from the operator to their employee. Then again I learn poorly in classroom settings and am therefore a poor judge of such things.

There is a certain level of confidence, of well-developed psychomotor associations, of introspection, of control of panic, that comes with experience. Whether it occurs at 50, 100, or 200 dives, or not at all, depends on the individual, and to some extent the kind of dives they do. I think that the case that 40, 60, and 100 are materially different points on that journey is, at best, tenuous.
 
Yes, divers vary widely as to competence with said number of dives. But the OP makes a very good point. I began solo diving with 75 dives ( albeit most of my dives are 30' or less). I began DM course at 158 dives. Both seemed about right for me. I, too have wondered why the 100 required for Self Reliant/Solo is so high and the required 40 for PADI DM so low--but failed to make the comparison like the OP did.
 
I've wondered about this too. After diving with a few same ocean instabuddies I looked into solo diver training, so I could at least be prepared with the proper equipment, skills, and mindset for what I already find myself doing unexpectedly. But it turns out that, while I could start training to be a DM, I can't yet start training to look after only myself.
 
they only require that a Divemaster have 40 dives to enroll (60 to complete). Does that make any sense to anyone?
Can you really go from zero to certified DM in only 20 dives?

I assume the low entry point is due to the nature of a lot of the DM certs done in the diving hotspots - i.e back-packers rocking up and wanting zero to hero courses. They need to keep feeding the money machine, and if the barrier was too high they wouldn't get candidates.
 
I'm pretty sure the number of dives was higher for DM many years ago in the 90s, I'm sure someone will chime in here if I'm wrong. Not that it mattered to me as I had 700+ dives when I started my DM course.

I did the PADI Self Reliant course when it was first offered here in the UAE, not that I have ever needed to show the card, but as a photographer I always sling a pony/stage, primarily for my buddy as I don't have an octopus on my main rig.

Personally I'd expect a DM to be competent enough to solo dive safely and to be honest I think 40 dives for entry is far too low, but they are just making the base of the pyramid wider. I'm sure there will be an "Assistant DM" course in the pipeline soon :wink:
 
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