Scubapro MK20 product recall

[Goldorak]

I just bought a second hand regulator + console setup for my wife for AUD$330:

• SP - MK20 1st stage
• SP - G250 2nd stage
• SP - R190 octo
• Uwatec - Aladin Pro

The regulator was only used for 10+ dives and has been gathering dust for about 8 years. Outside everything looks in mint condition, hoses are still nice and glossy.

Unfortunately it seems I should have done a bit more research because after buying I found this about the MK20:
Scubapro® Recalls MK 20 Scuba Regulators for Service
The recall note mentions that you can identify the problem units by the amount of vents on the side. Ours has 3 vents on the side, so I assume it has this problem.

I went to my LDS to get the regulator serviced and when I mentioned the recall to one of the employees, he was a bit baffled. I showed them the recall notice and the shop owner got called. He said that the 3 vents don't mean anything and that the recall wasn't applicable to all MK20's (even if they have 3 vents) and most probably wouldn't apply to this one because it was only 9 to 8 years old. I agreed to turn it in for servicing for the steep price of $120 (australian $).:mooner:

Now I do have my doubts and I'm wondering whether he was just saying that because he didn't want to go through all the hassle of doing the service for free and claim it back from Scubapro. The recall notice only mentions the 3 vents so what/who am I to believe? How can I confirm if our MK20 has this problem?

 

[timbalcomb]

Your Mk20 has a problem, specifically the one mentioned in the recall. Three vents in the saddle mean the update has NOT been done. This is important because if the un-shouldered yoke nut continues to be used, the yoke itself can develop stress fractures. With only 8 dives hopefully this isn't a problem yet, but you do want to get that nut replaced. Your ScubaPro dealer should be able to warranty the un-shouldered yoke nut for a shouldered one for free, but the rest of the service will still cost you. It's a good idea though, as o-rings from the past don't last as long as the new ones do, so even with only 8 dives you MK20 may have deteriorating o-rings inside it. Hope everything works out, and make sure you check the saddle for the updated 2 vent holes when you get it back from service.
-Tim Balcomb
Los Angeles, CA

 

[Goldorak]

Your Mk20 has a problem, specifically the one mentioned in the recall. Three vents in the saddle mean the update has NOT been done. This is important because if the un-shouldered yoke nut continues to be used, the yoke itself can develop stress fractures. With only 8 dives hopefully this isn't a problem yet, but you do want to get that nut replaced. Your ScubaPro dealer should be able to warranty the un-shouldered yoke nut for a shouldered one for free, but the rest of the service will still cost you. It's a good idea though, as o-rings from the past don't last as long as the new ones do, so even with only 8 dives you MK20 may have deteriorating o-rings inside it. Hope everything works out, and make sure you check the saddle for the updated 2 vent holes when you get it back from service.
-Tim Balcomb
Los Angeles, CA

Thanks Tim.
Do you know what the normal procedure is to service a SP regulator? Do they usually just open it up, install new O-rings, apply lube and test it? Or do they have to order a service kit from SP which will contain the service replaceable parts (incl. yoke nut) and then do the standard maintenance?
I'm asking because as it stands I have a feeling he will just do the bare minimum because he seemed pretty convinced that he didn't need to worry about the recall.

 

[redacted]

Your regulator can not be trusted to have had the defective retainer replaced. To do a proper service, the shop needs to remove the retainer anyway so I can not imagine why he would not replace the defective retainer with the new one that should be provided for free by Scubapro at that time. One possibility is that is a U.S. CPSC recall that may not apply in other countries.

 

[halocline]

Before you get too upset about it, you might do a little more reading about this recall. There have been thousands of MK20s in use for decades, and a very few (probably less than 10, but thats a guess) documented cases of stress fractures that were typically the result of seriously over-torqueing the yoke retainer. As long as the tech installs the yoke with the specified torque (or something close)of about 22 ftlbs, your regulator won't come flying apart. The replacement part for the recall is called the "universal" retainer (part 10103115) and is somewhat idiot proofed for the techs who insisted on using a manly approach to putting the reg together.

The saddle is supposed to be replaced as a way of indicating that the new retainer has been used. I have heard from a very reliable source that there was a SP dealer in central TX that thought the recall was simply replacing the saddle, not the actual retainer. Getting an idea why SP wanted to "idiot proof" their regulators? I can never remember how many slots in the saddle indicates the recall, but for any competent tech, it's easy to see whether the updated retainer is in use.

Anyhow, I'd hardly worry about it. Ask the dealer to make sure to install the part number I referenced along with the regular service. SP will give them one, if they're a dealer. If they get confused about that, just gently tell them that for $120, they really ought to make sure not to overtorque the retainer. Then find a new place for the next service.

Typical service includes disassembly, cleaning, and replacing the dynamic o-rings, bushings, and seats. It's possible that SP is now including all o-rings in its service kits (I haven't bought one in years) so they might replace them all, not just the dynamic ones. O-rings last a long time in static use; I wouldn't be too worried about it. The thing you should be concerned about is whether or not you have the brass-tipped piston. You can ask them that; if so, just have them replace it with the current composite piston from the MK25. It works so much better that I wouldn't even bother trying to make the brass one stop creeping. It will cost an extra $50 (U.S.) or so, and it's worth it.

 

[Goldorak]

The saddle is supposed to be replaced as a way of indicating that the new retainer has been used.

So he could've been correct in his statement that the saddle with 3 vents doesn't necessarily mean this first stage has this problem because the retainer might have been replaced without changing the saddle?

I'll ask him to make sure the retainer get's replaced with the part you mentioned. Hopefully he understands that I'm not trying to be a difficult customer but just want to be confident about my gear given it's importance...

The thing you should be concerned about is whether or not you have the brass-tipped piston. You can ask them that; if so, just have them replace it with the current composite piston from the MK25. It works so much better that I wouldn't even bother trying to make the brass one stop creeping. It will cost an extra $50 (U.S.) or so, and it's worth it.

Appreciate the tip, I will definitely mention this... given that it will add some extra $ to the servicing, I'm sure he won't mind... at least I hope.


In general, as a novice scuba diver, I am a bit surprised by the dive shop owners attitude towards bringing a recall to their attention.
Before went to this shop for servicing, I called a couple shops and could immediately notice the annoyance when I mentioned the recall and asking about the cost to get it fixed. Eventually I choose this shop because they have some other gear I wanted to check out.
I would assume that any LDS owner would understand the importance of a well working regulator and in the least one's confidence in it. Or am I really a difficult customer in assuming this?

 

[Zung]

Here's the official Scubapro bulletin.

It's a recall in the US, but not in the rest of the world, where the shops are instructed to replace the retainer quietly and free of charge during service, even if the owner is not the original one. The new plastic saddle is not necessarily part of the deal.

But a Scubapro dealer who has not heard of this may need some improvements, especially in their capability to read. Stay away from it.

I have half a dozen MK20 with the new retainer, but my personal one is still with the old/"dangerous" one; it has maybe 3-400 dives and zero problem. I'm not worried and I keep it as a bargaining point next time I go to the shop where I bought it (new).

 

[Goldorak]

Here's the official Scubapro bulletin.

Thanks Zung, I will email him this bulletin and see what he has to say. But I'm less and less worried about the recall reading the responses. But no harm in trying.