Unknown Praising my Instructors

[CrazyIdahoan]

I've been reading posts on this board for 3 months now and learned a lot...thought I'd share my experience from today, praise my instructors, and ask a few questions from those much more experienced than I am.

I just started diving 3 months ago while stationed here in Guam. After a month I got sick of renting and bought all of my own gear except a tank. I've gone through OW, Advanced OW, and Rescue Diver course and have a total of about 50 dives. Still a newbie but wanted to get as much training as I could up front to deal with any issues. So glad I did because today while diving I had two possibly related near misses and I'd like to get some thoughts.

Buddy and I who has gone through all of the same training with me were diving on a calm day and little current that we could see or feel. Followed a shelf down and followed along a wall at between 45 and 65 feet. Plan was to turn the dive at 1800 PSI then come up to 25-30 feet and swim back to the buoy. We've followed this same plan several times and generally return to the buoy at around 1000 lbs, explore around the buoy no more than 50 feet and then start a safety stop at 800 psi and surface at 700.

All was going well until we noticed we started moving pretty quickly with little effort. My dive buddy signaled to turn and we started back and upward at just over 2000 psi at about 60-65 feet. I found myself quickly start to feel winded. At 50 feet I suddenly had difficulty breathing and had to suck harder to get air - it felt a lot like the "out of air" drills or the first few seconds after a PT test where you sprinted the last 1/4 mile. My body wanted to breath in hard but my regulator wasn't giving me the air i needed. In a panic reaction, I reached to get my regulator out of my mouth so I could take a gasp of air. It is here that I have nothing but praise for my various instructors who had us run drills several times and both pounded it into our heads that no matter what happens, "slow down, you can solve any issue faster if you slow down".

As my hand grabbed my regulator my instructor's voice hit me loudly...slow down. I realized I was starting to panic and instead moved my hand to the adjustment knob on my regulator, opened it wide, which instantly gave me more air. I signaled my buddy to go straight up and I quickly (but safely) got to 15 feet where I leveled off and rested for a minute...my buddy giving me a quizzical look as I floated there. As I relaxed knowing the surface was close I gave the OK signal and started for the buoy. However checking my SPG I found I had burned almost 900 PSI since the turn. I'm now at 900 PSI in a strong current with a lot of distance to cover. We swam for a minute or two but then found myself winded and having difficulty again. By then I was at 650 PSI so I signaled a surface and we did a long surface swim to shore. Normally my buddy and I are within 50 PSI of each other at the end of a dive but he still had nearly 1300 PSI when we surfaced.

I chalked the whole thing up to swimming against a sudden strong current caused me to get winded and being over 50 feet caused anxiety which quickly started a vicious cycle...out of breath, anxious due to depth, trying to breath harder, more anxious because air isn't coming, breathing harder/faster, etc. Basically I thought I had a panic attack. Now I'm not so sure.

Later this afternoon we decided on a very easy in/out dive nearby we've done a dozen times. Everything was great as we descended to about 35 feet. We floated with an occasional kick for 2-3 minutes along the reef when it happened again. I was suddenly winded and had to suck hard to get air. As I started up it got worse and at 25 feet I grabbed my Octo which gave me good air until I surfaced (my buddy had his out in a flash right in front of my face the whole way up). I didn't feel panic this time but disappointment we only were in the water 5 minutes.

On the surface I tested my regulator and it seemed fine at first but after 15 or so breaths it got difficult to breath. Switched to Octo and everything was good. Tried regulator again and was fine for 15 breaths then got difficult to breath. On the shore I coincidentally found two of my instructors waiting for classes. They checked my tank (fully on), had me breath through the regulator and noticed it sounded labored after a bit, then swapped tanks with same results.

Right now I'm not sure if it is me (anxiety from hard swim and panic earlier) or a gear issue. I don't panic easily but do understand it can happen to anyone at any time. Last time I panicked was at a fireworks show after a year in Afghanistan.
Regulator and 1st stage: Aqualung Legend MBS - 2 months & 30 dives old
Octo: Aqualung Legend
Tank: Aluminum 80 CuFt (Rental)
Taking it in Monday to get checked out...Preliminary test showed intermediate pressure was 123 PSI and crack was at 2.6. Instructor thought the IP for that model was low and crack was high. Could have contributed to labored breathing.

So Thoughts? Could it be my gear or is it in my head? If it is gear, what could cause those symptoms (starts fine then suddenly gets hard, adjust knob and get more but gets hard again)?

 

[BoltSnap]

moved my hand to the adjustment knob on my regulator, opened it wide, which instantly gave me more air.

Did you have the cracking pressure adjustment knob turn in and not out all the way while diving? If so, this is your problem. The adjustment knob should always all the way out for the easiest breathing when the regulator is in your mouth during the dive. The ONLY time it should be turned in when you are breathing from it, is when there is air leaking from the second stage. You should turn the knob in just to stop the bubbles. The knob should be turned in when the regulator is out of your mouth and you are still in the water swimming back to the boat or shore on the surface.

You didn't notice that it was wrong to turn it in until you were in a high stress situation and had to breathe hard but the knob made it difficult to draw the air in so you had to work even harder.

 

[Edward3c]

I've been reading posts on this board for 3 months now and learned a lot...thought I'd share my experience from today, praise my instructors, and ask a few questions from those much more experienced than I am.

I just started diving 3 months ago while stationed here in Guam. After a month I got sick of renting and bought all of my own gear except a tank. I've gone through OW, Advanced OW, and Rescue Diver course and have a total of about 50 dives. Still a newbie but wanted to get as much training as I could up front to deal with any issues. So glad I did because today while diving I had two possibly related near misses and I'd like to get some thoughts.

Buddy and I who has gone through all of the same training with me were diving on a calm day and little current that we could see or feel. Followed a shelf down and followed along a wall at between 45 and 65 feet. Plan was to turn the dive at 1800 PSI then come up to 25-30 feet and swim back to the buoy. We've followed this same plan several times and generally return to the buoy at around 1000 lbs, explore around the buoy no more than 50 feet and then start a safety stop at 800 psi and surface at 700.

All was going well until we noticed we started moving pretty quickly with little effort. My dive buddy signaled to turn and we started back and upward at just over 2000 psi at about 60-65 feet. I found myself quickly start to feel winded. At 50 feet I suddenly had difficulty breathing and had to suck harder to get air - it felt a lot like the "out of air" drills or the first few seconds after a PT test where you sprinted the last 1/4 mile. My body wanted to breath in hard but my regulator wasn't giving me the air i needed. In a panic reaction, I reached to get my regulator out of my mouth so I could take a gasp of air. It is here that I have nothing but praise for my various instructors who had us run drills several times and both pounded it into our heads that no matter what happens, "slow down, you can solve any issue faster if you slow down".

As my hand grabbed my regulator my instructor's voice hit me loudly...slow down. I realized I was starting to panic and instead moved my hand to the adjustment knob on my regulator, opened it wide, which instantly gave me more air. I signaled my buddy to go straight up and I quickly (but safely) got to 15 feet where I leveled off and rested for a minute...my buddy giving me a quizzical look as I floated there. As I relaxed knowing the surface was close I gave the OK signal and started for the buoy. However checking my SPG I found I had burned almost 900 PSI since the turn. I'm now at 900 PSI in a strong current with a lot of distance to cover. We swam for a minute or two but then found myself winded and having difficulty again. By then I was at 650 PSI so I signaled a surface and we did a long surface swim to shore. Normally my buddy and I are within 50 PSI of each other at the end of a dive but he still had nearly 1300 PSI when we surfaced.

I chalked the whole thing up to swimming against a sudden strong current caused me to get winded and being over 50 feet caused anxiety which quickly started a vicious cycle...out of breath, anxious due to depth, trying to breath harder, more anxious because air isn't coming, breathing harder/faster, etc. Basically I thought I had a panic attack. Now I'm not so sure.

Later this afternoon we decided on a very easy in/out dive nearby we've done a dozen times. Everything was great as we descended to about 35 feet. We floated with an occasional kick for 2-3 minutes along the reef when it happened again. I was suddenly winded and had to suck hard to get air. As I started up it got worse and at 25 feet I grabbed my Octo which gave me good air until I surfaced (my buddy had his out in a flash right in front of my face the whole way up). I didn't feel panic this time but disappointment we only were in the water 5 minutes.

On the surface I tested my regulator and it seemed fine at first but after 15 or so breaths it got difficult to breath. Switched to Octo and everything was good. Tried regulator again and was fine for 15 breaths then got difficult to breath. On the shore I coincidentally found two of my instructors waiting for classes. They checked my tank (fully on), had me breath through the regulator and noticed it sounded labored after a bit, then swapped tanks with same results.

Right now I'm not sure if it is me (anxiety from hard swim and panic earlier) or a gear issue. I don't panic easily but do understand it can happen to anyone at any time. Last time I panicked was at a fireworks show after a year in Afghanistan.
Regulator and 1st stage: Aqualung Legend MBS - 2 months & 30 dives old
Octo: Aqualung Legend
Tank: Aluminum 80 CuFt (Rental)
Taking it in Monday to get checked out...Preliminary test showed intermediate pressure was 123 PSI and crack was at 2.6. Instructor thought the IP for that model was low and crack was high. Could have contributed to labored breathing.

So Thoughts? Could it be my gear or is it in my head? If it is gear, what could cause those symptoms (starts fine then suddenly gets hard, adjust knob and get more but gets hard again)?

Just because it’s new, or recently serviced, doesn’t mean it will not be faulty. Check the adjustment control to ensure it’s not malfunctioning.

It is possible to demand more air than your system can provide, if that happens - even for less than a second - your brain will tell you you’re not getting air. Good advice from your instructors, slow down a think through the situation. You had an attentive buddy, that’s not always the case, so you could of done an assisted ascent.

 

[VikingDives]

I'm not an Aqualung tech, but the IP seems low and that cracking pressure is way too high.

If I was servicing those regs, I want to know about the 15 breath thing. . . make sure you pass that on.

Good job on slowing down and not panicking @CrazyIdahoan

 

[Endler's]

'Suspect the foolish MBS design, of combining both Venturi & breathing adjustment, makes the knob restrict breathing even more than normal.

 

[Umuntu]

Preliminary test showed intermediate pressure was 123 PSI and crack was at 2.6.

That’s a high cracking effort … more than double that of a properly adjusted second stage.

 

[johndiver999]

I wonder if you have ever done any high exertion scuba swims before? I think a good instructor will encourage the student to do that at least once in order to experience what that feels like. If you had done this before, you might be able to answer your own question about an equipment issue versus a mental problem.

In the future, if you feel like your regulator is not performing properly at depth, you might consider asking a buddy to share his air and then immediately begin an exit strategy that makes the most sense.

Also, if the regulator seems to not be giving you enough air, you can often press the purge button and it should blow air at you and not make you suck. If the second stage was not tuned correctly (it sounds like it), this should make for much more comfortable breathing (as you work out an exit strategy).

This technique should also work if the second stage is cracked, or badly leaking or the exhaust is fouled etc. Definitely something to get comfortable with before an emergency.

 

[Umuntu]

You should also have tried switching to your octopus regulator

 

[CrazyIdahoan]

Thanks all for the responses. I'll post again once the tech has a chance to look at it. A few responses to comments:

• Did you have the cracking pressure adjustment knob turn in and not out all the way while diving?
  • Unfortunately, yes. Not much of a manual came with the regulator and the one i trained on had no external adjustments. Good to know that is how it is supposed to be used - I kept it turned down to slow my breathing, which is why when I caught myself panicking I immediately turned it up. that worked for a while (15 or so breaths) but didn't seem to be the whole problem.
• Cracking Pressure
  • The instructor thought it was really high as well but wasn't familiar with this setup. He is a Scuba Pro tech but I bought Aqualung because that is what my LDS at home services when i leave here.
• Purging if Air is needed...Thanks for the advice, that didn't even enter into my mind but is definitely I'll put in my arsenal to practice.
• High exertion swimming...Closest I got was during the rescue classes pulling a victim in but that was all at the surface. My poor 15 yo daughter wants to certify when I return home this spring - she has a lot of extra drills to do before she certifies. I'll add this to the list.
• Switch to Octo...didn't even think to do that on the first dive. Thought the problem was all me (winded, anxiety, panic, etc.). Equipment issue didn't occur to me until it was almost too late. However, on my second dive that was the first thing I did as I ascended.
• Attentive Buddy...even though we are both new I wouldn't trade him out for anything while I'm gaining experience. On the second dive when I signaled to go up his first reaction was to grab his octo and have it right in front of my face all the way up.

 

[dmaziuk]

'Suspect the foolish MBS design, of combining both Venturi & breathing adjustment, makes the knob restrict breathing even more than normal.

It's suboptimal (my mikron has the same "one knob") but it shouldn't restrict breathing. I dive with mine turned almost all the way off -- swimmer's lungs -- and do a degree or two adjustment when I feel like it. It breathes easy but it does not do miracles on high exertion swims: you have to work on your cardio if you're into those, so you can keep your breathing deep and even instead of overbreathing the reg.