Overhead environment rebreather thread

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JonG1

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Location
Glossop UK
# of dives
2500 - 4999
OK this might be get contentious.

I can foresee a side mount, chest mount, or Sidewinder (SW) style unit in my future given the nature of the most commonly encountered overhead in the UK. Some of this is or will be sump, some is flooded mine, often with awkward access routes to water. Depths are usually max of 25-30m and around 7-9 degrees c.

I am happy diving side mount OC and dive a KISS Classic BM at present. One of my most frequent diving partners dives a Triton so I have a reasonable insight to that unit, I'd really like to understand better some of the choices out there for this application, it's unlikely that the Choptima is an option in the UK AFAIK.

The obvious or "most popular" option appears to be the Sidewinder but I'd be really keen to objectively breakdown the issues, understand whether there are work arounds to any of them by means of configuration choice, after market changes etc.

Like I say it would be good to keep it objective so that no-one falls out but it would help me and maybe others to make an informed choice when the time comes. There have been many treads where the SW has been discussed but may be easier/better for reference to collate them in 1 thread.

I am going to hopefully look over my overhead instructor's SW soon, who has recently changed from a Triton to a SW.
 
Do you know Mike Thomas? He has a sidewinder, dives in the UK and is CDG. As well as being an all-round good geezer and terrific pragmatic instructor.
 
Yeah I know Mike by association, and Ian France who is diving one too so will be tapping Ian up for sure.
 
Ian is going to convince you to go for the Triton :)
As a buddy of a Triton diver, how do you feel about this unit related to your kind of diving? Thanks
 
Ian has sold his Triton AFAIK in favour of the SW.

I like the Triton tbf, it's very adaptable in terms of configuration, MCCR which I prefer, light weight works with any SM harness.

Not sure about the hud, bespoke PPO2 monitor or loop hoses that seem to mainly fit the eye wateringly expensive divesoft BOV.
 
The biggest most overlooked flaws on the SW to me are:
1) built quality is low, its PVC and cheap plastic and made in a proverbial garage
2) total lack of any objective testing on duration or CE etc
3) The exhale scrubber is basically the first water trap and soaking wet sorb is not as effective and alters WOB etc. Which would influence #2 if there were even any data available.

There are positives to the unit but these are 3 very significant minuses that have no workaround.

I can foresee a side mount, chest mount, or Sidewinder (SW) style unit in my future given the nature of the most commonly encountered overhead in the UK. Some of this is or will be sump, some is flooded mine, often with awkward access routes to water. Depths are usually max of 25-30m and around 7-9 degrees c.

For nitrox dil/bo in these depth ranges it does work pretty well. Like many SM systems it starts turning into a CF once you need to carry a deco bottle (vs just drop one at the entrance of a cave) and have trimix necessitating a suit gas bottle.
 
Oops, I didn't know about Ian's switch.
Just take the Monox as a secondary monitor and get the petrel :)
Regarding the loop hoses, the BOV is, in my opinion, not needed and it is really easy to turn the hose to adjust the orientation during the dive
 
What rjack said. The sidewinder has some pretty damn big negatives. Enough that I saw when I took the class that I chose not to own one. I think we will see more major incidents/accidents with the sidewinder in the future. I believe in the right hands it is safe, but it really should be for experienced ccr divers looking to add a sm unit. And even then, someone should actually realistically discuss the negatives, because I've yet to meet an instructor that doesn't claim it's god's gift to the earth and the cure for chlamydia.
 
why do you say the Choptima is out? that said it's basically the same as a Triton so if your buddy got rid of his for another unit that will likely sway your decision against anything else of similar style.
There are only a handful of actual sidemount units on the market, KISS Sidekick, SF2, Liberty, etc. and the downside to all of them is that they are very heavy in comparison to something like a Sidewinder or Choptima/Triton since they have a frame around them. I wouldn't look at them for sump diving.

Frankly I would have thought that the Triton/Choptima would have been the leader for this type of diving. Easy to throw sidemount or backmount bottles on, easy to don/doff if you have to or want to, and is not tied to a very specific harness so you can put whatever you need/want on your back. It is possible to put stuff on your back with a SW and some guys in the KUR that are using them as bailout breathers have a full rack mounted reg on their back, but a chest mounted unit is definitely going to be the most versatile...

Oh, and disclaimer, my primary rebreather is actually a sidemount unit very similar to the Sidekick, so it's not like I'm against sidemount units, just specific use cases.
 

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