"Overfilling" faber lp 85,95

[northcoastdiver]

I'm considering faber lp 85 or 95 tanks, and have heard that, outside the US, Faber lp tanks are rated at a higher working pressure. Is this why many faber/oms tank owners routinely "overfill" their tanks, and if so, what is the normal overfill pressure for steel tanks with a working pressure of 2400+?

 

[DA Aquamaster]

A plus rating allows a 10% overfill. in the case of a tankwith a 2400 psi working pressure that would be 2640 psi.

Under DOT regs, a 10% overfill cannot be exceeded on a plus rated tank and the certification standards both are rigourous conservative in terms of working pressure and burst pressure. Other countires may have other tank certification standards that would allow the "same" tank to be filled to a higher service pressure or the tank may be operating under an exemption where the expected maximum life of the tank is not a completly known quantity or guarenteed.

In my opinon, overfilling tanks beyond what is allowed by the regs is not only illegal, it is a really bad idea.

 

[Derek S]

I own a Faber steel 95, and my LDS routinely fills it to 2800psi. I've yet to have an issue with it. YMMV.

 

[pdoege]

If they have the + rating they are good to 2640.

In cave country you can get them filled to 3500psi.

I've seen 4200psi with no issues.

Peter

 

[mempilot]

My Faber/OMS LP98's get filled to 3000 on every fill, with the occasional 3400 fill. My LDS won't do it after the first hydro though. I'll trade them in on new ones, and they will become part of the rental gear.

 

[babar]

I just ordered my PST E8-119 which are rated to 3450. My understanding is that there is no difference between them and the lp 95 except that pressed steel put in the time and money to test them and get the higher DOT rating. Up here in the northwest, many diveshops pretty rountinely overfill LP tanks to 3000 or 3500.

babar

 

[COVCI]

babar,

Unfortunately, your understanding is actually a misunderstanding. PST E8 series cylinders are made from a completely different alloy than Faber cylinders manufactured and sold in the US. This is just one of many differences in the cylinders.

US DOT Definition--Overfilling:
Filling a cylinder beyond the rated service pressure at 70F.

This means if the cylinder is rated for service at 2640 and you fill it to 2650 you have overfilled the cylinder and this is illegal by US DOT standards.

The question that may come from this example of the US DOT definition may be WHO is held to the US DOT standard...anyone involved in commerce...did you charge for the fill? If so, you are legally bound to follow DOT requirements.

ALL cylinder manufacturers stress that overfilling of cylinders is not permitted, is not necessary and causes progressive and unreversible damage.

Simple answer: Don't overfill. If you need more gas, use a different cylinder.

Hope this helps to clear up any misunderstanding you may have about PST/FABER cylinders.

Chris

 

[hex92]

The LDS owner nearest me pushes the faber 95s. He sets them up with the high pressure valves (3500 psi) and routinely overfills them over 3000 if asked. I know that he fills his personal tanks to over 3400 psi. He says that they are the same tanks that are rated to higher fill pressures in Europe so screw the US regulations.

He tried to sell me on the idea when I was in the market for tanks. But I had a couple of problems with it. First of all I felt I was too tall for the 95s. Then I called around to find out if I could get overfills easily at other shops. Not all would do it.

So in the end I settled on HP 120s from another shop. Its sometimes hard to get full fills (3442 psi), but I don't have to worry about someone telling me the won't overfill my tank.

 

[Leadking]

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bobby F
Yes they exist and the funny thing is that the steel tanks that are LP in the US are 300 bar in europe (actually just below). The Fabers are rated to 4K over there and 2640 here. That is why a lot of people don't have an issue with over filling the LP tanks.




I will tackle this issue again. Faber does not make a cylinder greater than 7" diameter that goes to 4000 psi for anyone in the world. The do make a version that resembles a steel 85. When you look at the manufacturers drawing and compare the weight the HP version weights 10 more pounds than our version.

Just because your getting away with it does not mean it is safe

 

[Jason B]

babar,

Unfortunately, your understanding is actually a misunderstanding. PST E8 series cylinders are made from a completely different alloy than Faber cylinders manufactured and sold in the US. This is just one of many differences in the cylinders.

I think he was refering to the PST 95 as being similar to the PST E8-119, not the Faber 95.

Jason